The short version:
I’m a junior doc. I moved to a town in England to do some Locum work. Ending up seeing a woman there. She said she was 31 and had a 3 year old. We saw each other for 9 months. She insisted on not using condoms and said she was on the pill. I still usually used condoms but occasionally didn’t. She said many times she would have an abortion if she ever got pregnant and told me she didn’t want to have kids with me(she had had abortions in the past).
I made it very clear I wasn’t ready for kids.
9 months in I found out she was actually 38 and also had an 18 year old daughter as well as the 3 year old (and was also likely cheating on me).
I decided to end things with her. Unfortunately at that point she told me she was pregnant and she decided to keep the baby.
She hangs up on me whenever I don’t agree with her. She is not giving me any say in naming (won’t even concede a middle name). She is anti vaccination and will not discuss it with me at all.
Because of the above and her general personality, I feel it would be best to not be directly involved with her or the child at all and I consider myself an unwilling sperm donor.
My normal salary is £39000 and will be for the next 4-5 years.
I do occasionally locums (short term hourly contracts) which can briefly increase my salary however this work is inconsistent and far and few between.
She has said she is happy to reach a family based arrangement of £300 per month (as she has done with the father of the 3 year old) however I believe she is lying and plans to go through CMS as she appears to think my regular salary is far higher than it actually is (because of the locum work I was doing).
Morally I’m lost. I have no real say in anything and I don’t want to spend the rest of my life being emotionally manipulated by this woman.
Financially and legally, I don’t know where to start. I called CMS to get some clarity and they were very vague. The things I read on line have me very worried. I’m imagining the CMS basing their calculations on my locum work, however I only do this occasionally and will likely stop in the next year or so as I will be going into further training and my salary will be locked at £39000.
My dad has also cut me off and is no longer speaking to me.
I have no idea how I’m going to meet someone now. After my experience with this woman I know I don’t really want to go out with someone who already has kids, but no I find myself being a hypocrite as this child will exist and I am bound to it forever, whether I like it or not.
Any advice is much appreciated.
Long version below:
I’m hoping I’ll be able to get some advice and guidance as I’m new to this situation.
Above was the short version, however here is the full story. I’m open to any thoughts/criticisms/advice people are able to give as this whole situation is really getting on top of me.
In 2015 I qualified as a doctor and have spent the past few years moving from post to post. Never had a girlfriend at school or Uni and generally struggled with girls.
Junior doctors wages are good but not amazing however I was quite comfortable to be fair. I went down the surgical route, so lots of on calls and trauma. In a regular contracted job I make £39,000 per year give or take.
I decided to take a year out to do some locuming (get paid hourly on a short term basis) in order to save money to get a house and car.
I found an amazing opportunity down in a town in the south of England where they were paying £50 an hour and letting people do 48 hour shifts (eg walk into the hospital Monday 08:00 and walk out Wednesday 08:00). I jumped at the opportunity and moved down to this town.
I was supposed to be there for 3 months (October to December. In the first couple weeks I jumped on Tinder (where I had very little success in the past) and pretty quickly matched with a girl (let’s call her Lucy). On her profile she was 31 years old (I was 27) and she worked at a beauty salon.
In all honesty I thought she was REALLY hot and I couldn’t believe we’d matched. I actually thought she was a bot or something. We got chatting and pretty quickly she agreed to go out for a drink. A couple weeks later I meet her at a bar and we hit it off. So well in fact that by the end of the night she took me back to her apartment etc etc.
She told me she hadn’t slept with anyone for over a year (this turned out to be a lie. We bumped into a pretty shady looking guy at a cafe while out with her friend. Her friend decided to reveal that she’d slept with this guy on a drunken one night stand 6 months earlier. He also turned out to be the local weed dealer.)
She seemed perfectly fine with having unprotected sex (which should have been a huge alarm bell for me) but I insisted on using a condom despite her re-assuring me that she was taking a contraceptive pill.
We started to see each other weekly and then slowly more frequently. She knew I was leaving at the end of December and so we agreed to part ways then.
In terms of Lucy’s living situation, she had a 3 year old daughter and rented an apartment in the town centre but seemed to mostly stay with her parents (who also housed her brother) in a fairly nice neighbourhood outside the town.
The apartment honestly looked like a bomb site. Rotting food on the dishes, clothes strewn everywhere, toys piled all over the room. I have literally never seen a messier apartment. I offered to help her tidy it up a few times but she never seemed bothered.
December came and we ended things in a really friendly manner. I went away until March and then the hospital asked me to come back for a higher rate. I came back and agreed to stay until September. I gave Lucy a call and she seemed keen to see me again. Once again we agreed on no promises but that we’d stay exclusive and see where things go until September.
Now throughout this time she told me she wasn’t speaking to or seeing anyone else. She also told me she hadn’t slept with anyone else. Long story short this was a lie. I did something very wrong (went on her phone). I saw at least a dozen messages from other guys who she was making arrangements to meet up with. She’d been seeing at least two other guys in December while she told me she was only seeing me. I then saw a message between her and her best friend discussing a night in February (while I was away to be fair) where she seems to have gone home with a complete stranger, she never got his name.
When I confronted her about this she told me she was only talking to the other guys because I wasn’t committing to her and that the stranger from February was ‘just a guy I took home to do some coke with because we couldn’t do it in the club’.
At this point I should have just ended things, but because I had been so alone and desperate throughout my life I decided to just move past it. I told her that I wanted to be serious with her and commit to her in a proper relationship.
Her ex (father of her 3 year old) hated me with a passion. We never met however we walked past each other a few times around town. He would frequently describe me as ‘the ugly asian guy’ and on one occasion ‘Paki’ (I’m not Pakistani or even South Asian).
Eventually Lucy told me that she really didn’t like using condoms as they didn’t ‘feel good’. I told her I didn’t want children and didn’t want to run the risk of a pregnancy. She assured me she was on the pill and would look me dead in the eye and say: ‘I don’t want any kids with you, kids are the last thing I need right now, even if I got pregnant I would have an abortion’. We agreed on multiple occasions that we were on the same page (abortion of a pregnancy occurred).
Like an idiot, I would occasionally not use a condom.
July came and the truth began to unravel.
First I began to realise she was bulimic and would throw up most of the food we ate and did not want to discuss it or accept my support in any way.
I then found out she was 38, not 31.
And finally the real kicker, an 18 year old cousin she had introduced me to was not her cousin at all, but her first daughter.
I decided I was going to end things with her but wanted to do it gently and thought it would be better to slowly let it fizzle out come September rather than just bluntly end things now that all this information had come to light. What an idiot I was.
In mid-August I went home for the weekend. I get a call from Lucy: I’m pregnant.
I tried to stay calm and asked her how she felt and what she wanted to do. She completely blew up, hung up on me and wouldn’t take my calls. I made it clear to her that I did not want kids and that we always agreed on abortion (she had had several abortions in the past, so obviously wasn’t morally above the idea). I remained civil and polite throughout (I have all the WhatsApps saved) and she unleashed a torrent of abuse at me.
Eventually in September she told me she had decided to keep the baby.
A lot of drama/arguments unfolded. I tried to speak to her parents who kicked me out of their house (I recorded the whole conversation incase any ever questioned my tone or behaviour, which was polite and non-confrontational).
My father has cut me off, my mother is being supportive (but I know she’s heartbroken). Same goes for my sister.
Very few of my friends know what’s going on. But those that do have been supportive.
I am back in touch with Lucy and have made it clear that despite being forced into this situation I will willingly pay money towards this child in support. When I tried to discuss anything with her it became pretty clear it was her way or the highway. She’s indirectly made it clear that I have no real say in choosing a name. I offered that she choose the first name and I choose the middle name, however she has decided she wants to choose the first name (Trixie) and the middle name is to be after her mother.
Worst of all however, is that Lucy is an anti-vaxer, and when I tried to discuss and reason it with her, she told me to ‘f**k off’ and just hung up the phone and stopped answering for a week. This is a pretty common move whenever she’s challenged.
I am EXTREMELY confused and lost in finding a way to navigate this situation and I hope some of you might be able to offer some insight/advice.
First of all, morally:
I never wanted this child however I accept that my choices and actions have led to its inception. I would have supported an abortion up until 12 weeks but we’re well past that now (20 weeks at the time of this post).
I’ve struggled with whether or not to be present in this child’s life. On the one hand I feel that every child should know their father. On the other hand, it breaks my heart that I’ll have zero say or input in the real upbringing and healthcare of this child. Anti-Vaccination is insanity to me as a medical professional and is akin to child abuse in my opinion. Being powerless in the department is very upsetting.
For me personally, I have no idea how I’m going to find a partner in the future as I really think the existence of this child a deal breaker for most women. I struggled in the past and now I just see this as an impossibility.
I have no problem paying money towards this child however my income fluctuates A LOT. In between training posts, if I locum my income could be upwards of £7000 on some months, but some months could be £2000 or less. Some months I may not even locum and earn nothing.
Once I start a contracted specialty training post my salary will drop to £39000 again for the foreseeable future. I’m really concerned that if I do any locum work the CMS will overestimate my actual normal income and slap me with a huge Child Support bill that I won’t be able to keep up with once my salary drops back to £39000.
Lucy’s ex pays her £300 per month. When we were dating she told me she doesn’t actually need but happily accepts it (and even emotionally manipulates him saying she can’t pay the bills for the flat etc. even though she’s fine. She seems to have forgotten she told me that because she tried pulling the same line on me last week).
She has told me she never planned to contact me once we fell out of contact, but if I want to be involved she will accept a family based arrangement of £300.
In-between complaining of having no money for her flat she informed me that she really requires me to buy her a £1500 iCandy designer pram. When I asked her why she needed that model and not a cheaper one she laid into me saying she wants the ‘all black’ one.
When I questioned this further, she sent me a picture of the ultra-sound scan, which I hadn’t seen before saying she thought it was about time I saw this. Previously I told her I wasn’t ready to see any pictures. She was clearly trying to emotionally manipulate me.
Dealing with someone who is (in my opinion) such an idiot when it comes to finances is driving me crazy.
I have settled on not being directly involved with her or the child and just paying my dues from a distance. I am very concerned that she will try to come after me via the Child Maintenance Service and put an attachment on my earnings.
Like I said I am happy to contribute £300 or more depending on what the child needs. However, if I am locuming and earning extra money I know for a fact the child won’t see that money and it will instead go into her pocket for her next round of botox injections, lip fillers and a boob job she has had her eye on for some time.
I’m really at a loss with what to do and could use some guidance/advice if anyone is willing to give any.
Finally I’d like to leave a few of my current thoughts behind.
1. Abortions - If the roles were reversed and I wanted to keep the baby but she wanted to have an abortion, there would be absolutely nothing stopping her. I find it amazing that a woman has the right to kill a baby but a man doesn’t have the right to financially separate themselves if they never actually wanted this child
2. Why should child support be uncapped. If a man suddenly finds himself with a massive increase in salary, why should the mother earn more money from child support? Children need money to a point, anything beyond is excess and goes right into the mother’s pocket. Why? Child support should be paid up until a limit.
Reflecting on this situation it was inevitable. I was desperate and she clearly saw me coming.
My biggest piece of advice to all of you out there who haven’t been trapped. First of all, always use a condom, no matter what these women tell you because they lie.
Secondly, PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE be so careful who you choose to sleep with and date. A girl with big lips and a nice body is great, but if they are like Lucy, then stay the hell away, it isn’t worth it.
I’ve lost my dad. I feel nothing but shame in front of my friends. I feel like any prospect of a future partner is out the window and financially I will be burdened with this for the rest of my working life. All for a few nights of sex.
Honestly, if she was 32 I was have considered making a go of things, because at that age we could have maybe started a family. But at 38 it’s no or never with more kids, and I’m not even ready to have one, let alone the two or three that I’d always imagined.
Thank you for taking the time to read this and please, any advice, moral or legal is much appreciated.
Hi there. That's quite a story. Speaking broadly, first thing I would say is try to worry about things as they happen - she's talking about a family based arrangement of £300 - she named that figure herself, so it's possible she might stick with this - just make sure you keep records of all payments/contributions. If she does renege on this at some point in the future, the CMS will get involved from the moment the application is made, and won't be seeking backdated payments. If you are worried/certain she will make an application, you could take control once the baby is born by making the application yourself and presenting your own figures rather than any inflated ones your ex might try to claim on.
The reality of your situation is you did have control re you choosing to protect yourself during intercourse (which would protect you from STDs , quite apart from an unwanted pregnancy), and a child is now on the way for which you will legally have responsibilities towards until adulthood. If you have any doubts about the child being yours as you mention your suspicions she might have been with other guys, then that might be something you would need to follow up after the child has been born. I don't envy your predicament, but if you're going to be a responsible father to a child who is blameless in this situation, then you will have to be prepared to see this as a long-haul journey with bumps in the road along the way. How 'involved' a dad you are will be up to you and your ex.
A lot of men panic when a child is on the way - even the ones that are ready for fatherhood. Try and think about it from the baby's point of view.
Finally, I would caution against mentioning your ex by name in a public forum. If word gets to your ex about this because she is easier to identify, it could make your situation worse.
please don't commit financially just yet. who knows how many men shes been sleeping with before and during the time shes been with you. theres a chance you may not even be the father of the baby. you have the right to tell CMS your not sure the baby is yours.
I think the first thing you should do once the baby is born is to have a paternity test done to establish whether you are the father or not. This would need to be done by a laboratory that is recognized and the results accepted by the courts and / or C.M.S. just in case they get involved at some stage.
I personally think it is essential a paternity test is carried out in light of what you have written.