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School holidays 2 years 10 months ago #80330

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Hello

My son as a a child arrangement order in place for contact with his son, that was drawn up at the final hearing in court. For the long 6 week holiday its states. Child to spend 2 separate periods of 1 week with both the mother and the father and share the remaining weekends.
The ex is proposing He as his child from 10am on Saturday through to 6pm on the following Friday. (6 overnights). We think it should be from the Saturday to the Saturday. What do you think?
She gives herself from 6pm on Friday through to Saturday 10am (8 overnights).

One thing after another :(

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School holidays 2 years 10 months ago #80343

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Well, as 1 week is 7 days/nights, I would agree that your son should have him until Saturday morning, however getting her to agree this will probably be another matter. Your son could apply for a Specific Issue Order, but he would still need to try mediation first. Perhaps that might be enough to get the mother to tow the line, or your son could write a letter to her to suggest that a week is seven days and nights and if she won't agree to this as stated in the order, he willl have no option but to take it back to court.

Best of luck

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DadTalk Moderator... I'm not legally trained and my responses are my own views based on my experiences of the family court. I have plenty of common sense and can offer you emotional support and guide you to answers.

School holidays 2 years 10 months ago #80363

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You could suggest that since she thinks 6 nights is a week, then she should have 6 nights only and see how well she takes that!

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School holidays 2 years 9 months ago #80994

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Thank you.

Done both of those. Already going back to court for another issue, so we are going to add this to the list. She has told her that her legal team are working on the issues. I think she's trying to scare us. Mediation is not suitable, mediator is going to sign the C100, £96 !!

Another issue now raising its ugly head is, she keeps telling my grandson that when he sleeps over at my sons house, that he is going on a sleepover. My son doesn't like this and asked her not to say this, just say going to daddy house to sleep for 3 nights. She insist nothing wrong with what she tells him and compares it to when his cousin have a sleepover at his house and then go HOME. I've asked my grandson when you stay at mommy's is that a sleepover, he says no that's home. Should we just let this go, are we being petty over this or is she.
She's also told him that she doesn't like him having a sleepover at daddy's, because she misses him. Is it any wonder he shows signs of anxiety. Again she has been asked not to say these sort of things to him. My son was told to grow up.

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School holidays 2 years 9 months ago #80999

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Personally, I would let it go that it's being called a sleepover, more because it's one that would be difficult to enforce and will cause your grandson anxiety if he gets caught in the middle of it. However, her saying that she gets anxious when your grandson comes to sleep at your son is more concerning - I'd consider suggesting that you'll ask the court that she should get councelling about that so she doesn't affect your grandson. You never know, just the idea that a court might order her to get councelling might micraculously cure her.

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School holidays 2 years 9 months ago #81016

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I'm with actd on this... pick your battles, the court might see this type of arguement as petty. Try and step back a little, it's never a good idea to involve a child by questioning them. If the subject comes up in conversation then just make a joke of it but tell him he has two homes, one with mummy and one with daddy. Again with the being missed situation, I think it's ok to say he's missed, his daddy could also say that when you love someone it's ok to miss them when they're not there.

All the best

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School holidays 2 years 9 months ago #81024

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That's what we say mommy's house and daddy's house. We don't plan on raising this as a court issue. I'm sure you can imagine that with a 2 year court case, there have been many, many headaches and heartbreak. We are so grateful for the independent social worker who worked on the case. My son has a great child arrangement order in place and as he lives with us we get to see our grandson every 3 days, inc. long sleepovers lol, after not seeing him for 2 years, this time is precious. It was the ex's father who paid for the independent social worker, who believed that she would discredit my son and us his family, as it happens she saw straight through them and it was them that got the bad report, she gave my son a glowing report. my son has suggested that she needs to talk to someone as her actions are totally selfish and all based on her feelings not the child's. Her father is extremely controlling of the whole family and she try's to do the same with the child and with my son. She will go to any lengths to try to catch my son out on something so she can use it against him. she has even done some secret recording at a cafcass meeting and at contact sessions, by hiding a recording device in the child's pushchair. My son has told her that he is applying back to the courts for shared residency, holidays abroad to be agreed and childcare arrangements while he works, this was in the hope that she would work on these with him. She has now replied that her legal team will be instructed to work on this. My son was planning on representing himself, hoping for a straightforward variation on the current court order. Learning fast that nothing is ever going to be straightforward again.

Sorry for downloading, when my grandson is not here, I feel constantly worried for him, Im anxious about next court case. he has been here all weekend just gone back to her, so I'm waiting for the email to arrive,having a go at us about something or other!!
x

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School holidays 2 years 9 months ago #81027

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Goodness! Were the court and CAFCASS aware of the covert recording and placement of a device in the child's pushchair? There is existing case law concerning a father that used the same tactic and lost residency, largely because of it. Here's a link to the case, it sets a precendent and can be used in court as case law.

www.familylawweek.co.uk/site.aspx?i=ed161028

I completely understand your anxiety and desire to protect and assist your son, it's only natural and nothing more than a loving mother would do. You have no need to apologise Jnny.

When litigation has been ongoing for so long, it's very easy to lose perspective and get entangled in every little detail, things can get blown up in our minds eye and it's at such times that it's best to step back and take a little time out to regulate our approach. The more you can detach yourselves from the emotionality of your situation, the better.

All the best

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DadTalk Moderator... I'm not legally trained and my responses are my own views based on my experiences of the family court. I have plenty of common sense and can offer you emotional support and guide you to answers.

Last Edit: by Mojo.

School holidays 2 years 9 months ago #81223

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Neither Cafcass or the courts took any action about the recordings done.

My son has now had the meeting with the mediator, C100'signed. We have taken the C100 to the courts, waiting for date. Presumably my son will need to submit a statement, so we are working on that now. He is going for shared residency as well. We are thinking not going to be successful' but going to give it our best, I am going to be his Mackenzie friend. If we think not going to get it and he does, then will be bonus. I am aware of the welfare checklist. Any help/advice on how to put a good case forward, would be appreciated.

Thank you

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School holidays 2 years 9 months ago #81254

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If never ceases to amaze me how weak some courts can be, if it happens again I would most certainly push for action to be taken, if there is a next time you can use case law to argue your position.

It's always a good idea to prepare a brief position statement to take with you to,the hearing, it helps the court to,get a handle on the situation, so stick to the facts and allow them to draw their own conclusions. Keep it brief and avoid bad mouthing the mother, but do express concerns in a calm and reasoned manner. Tackle the issues from the child's position... the welfare checklist can guide you in this.

It's a good idea to suppress expectations, especially at the start of proceedings, it can often seem that things aren't going in your favour at the beginning, but this can change quickly as the case progresses. Patience is your best friend too as the process can grind on slowly.

All the best. If you need any help please don't hesitate to ask.

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DadTalk Moderator... I'm not legally trained and my responses are my own views based on my experiences of the family court. I have plenty of common sense and can offer you emotional support and guide you to answers.

School holidays 2 years 8 months ago #81488

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Thank you. The court date arrived today it's 2nd March. We are working on statement. It seems that the courts are asking for cafcass to do something, it's states safeguarding - cafcass to respond within 17 days, we had safeguarding checks, done first time round. Is this part of normal procedure to involve cafcass again?

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School holidays 2 years 8 months ago #81492

Hello Jnny,

I too am a grandmother to two young children. There are a number of common factors between your Son's situation and my Son's. To see our Sons suffer the emotional torment this type of Ex causes is most upsetting because we cannot take an active role in resolving the issues between the parents, they and the court are the ones who will determine the outcome. However, we can support our Sons quietly in the background and help to create a fun, happy, loving, and secure home environment for when the grandchildren come home to their fathers.

I would like to comment on the emotional aspects, first the term "sleepover," I would let this go and gently use your own terminology at the appropriate time. For instance when we talk to our children on arrival we say "it's lovely you're home for the weekend," other times we may use the terminology "Mummy's house or Daddy's house," on occasions we may say in a happy encouraging manner, "aren't you lucky having two homes?" Over a period of time the environment you create and the natural use of the word "home" by you as a family will eventually lead him to think of it as home irrespective of the fact the Mother calls it a "sleepover."

We also listen carefully to comments the children make to assess what their life is like when away from us but we NEVER ask them questions about their Mother, her family or make any adverse comment about any of them. If they tell us something their Mother has said which is totally incorrect we do not labour the point but say that is not true. The children's time with us is our time and we do not let their Mother influence those precious days.

You say quote, "told him that she doesn't like him having a sleepover at daddy's because she misses him," we have had exactly the same when returning the children to her, there is this big display from the Mother towards the children stating how much she has missed them, in reality making the children feel guilty, they then respond to her in the manner their Mother wishes them to. I abhor this drama queen approach and cultivating responses in a child which are not natural. We keep a close eye on how it affects them and their reactions. I think we have made headway in the approach we take, in returning them to their Mother the other week they were openly expressing and singing in the car, "we don't want to go to Mummy's, we don't want to go back to Mummy's, we want to stay with Daddy." Children are very astute they know where they are happiest, free and confident to openly express themselves.

It may well prove to be that your family's approach and measured responses to your grandchild could well override the Mother's influence on him given time

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Last Edit: by MotherofaFather.
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