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]Hi there i am hoping to get some help or information about my current situation.
I have had custody of my son who is 5 years old who lives with me and my partner. His mum is Thai and was bought here on a residency visa and who now also has a new partner and a baby by him. We have been seperated for 2years now. Due to the fact she was cheating, hitting me and doing what ever she wanted. Sometimes not returing home for days. she also would physically abuse my son. My son goes to stay with them every other weekend and has done since may 2011-they have caused many problems since over nights started by late collections and arguments in front of him but also since then he is showing the old signs of unhappy behaviour since overnights commenced. Although he enjoys going with his mother every other weekend, his behaviour has deteriorated and is back to hitting, shouting, being angry and not doing as he is told, he used to have this behaviour when his mother had full time care of him and never made any effort with him. Recently during the final hearing in July( this was to determin holiday contact) they disclosed a video of him alleging that my partner hits him and they recorded the bruising, social services were called in to investigate and my son and partners daughter went through questioning from social services and police. The case was closed within a matter of days due to no findings and the police said it looked like he was put up to it. The court has not read the report by social services as they are bringing in a guardian to talk to my son, me and my ex wife to determin the current sate of things. They say that a hearing is in DECEMBER to determine wether contact should continue or stop based on the guardians report. Then a final hearing will be next year in May. But since then they made recent further allegations against my partner again saying that she is continuing to hit him and brought him to a police station where they took pictures of bruising. Although we know there was no bruising and have proof of this as he was taken to the doctors b4 he went to stay with them and they noted down there was no bruising on him. Since these further allegations my life with my son is very difficult as i feel i have to watch his every move, my partner cant be on her own with him as she is worried for her own daughter, and this means i have to take him and collect him from school which is now affecting my work!!! I am currently seeking an emergency court hearing to determine stopping contact arrangements until december. Based on previous experience i am rightly very concerned my son is being used as a weapon in the protracted residence application. There is no thought as to how this is effecting our son and it is having a serious detrimental effect on his confidence, self-esteem and mental state. It is paramount he is safe-guarded until assessments are done as the deterioration is progressively getting worse and his mother will not stop with pressurising him until she gets what she wants. I don't know what to do as social services are concerned and have stated they feel contact should stop until a further hearing, yet his guardian is stating it should continue till december when she has enough evidence to make a decision. Could someone please give me some advise as i am worried its going to be too late for my son by the time my ex-wife gets what she wants.
There could be visa problems for her at the moment. She is currently on a dependants visa that has been extended but i've been told my ex wife needs custody of our son to stay here. Could this be another motive to intensify her challenge at residency?
If i could get some sort of responce or advice that would be much appreciated. 🙄
Many Thanks in advance.
Hi warhol,
I'll try and have a good crack at this particular post as its gone unanswered...
1: When your wife was attacking you/your son did you ever report this?
2: You say that your son goes over every other weekend with the Mum... can i assume that the guardian is the person with Residency or recognised as a Custodian?
3: Very unlikely) but what actions did you take after the false allegations of abuse?
4: Have you raised your ex's motives for residency being as you suspect the stay permanently with the Courts?
If you answer the above i will be able to make more of a story and give more of a solution (hopefully).
Excuse me for being blunt but... why haven't you stopped contact, and sought (through Courts) a Restraining Order and an application through the courts for no contact. Again, being blatantly honest even if half of what your story is true, to me and i'm sure others there is a serious issue afoot here.
I never like saying that stopping contact is "ever" a good decision however i do feel from what you are saying then there is a clear safeguarding risk to this childs (your childs) welfare and i would seriously urge you to act via Solicitors, Police or directly through the courts. If you need to know what steps to take in respect of the above, feel free to reply.
I never like saying that stopping contact is "ever" a good decision however i do feel from what you are saying then there is a clear safeguarding risk to this childs (your childs) welfare and i would seriously urge you to act via Solicitors, Police or directly through the courts. If you need to know what steps to take in respect of the above, feel free to reply.
To add to Yoji's comment, you may wish to read a document entitled "child Contact with non-resident parents", ISBN 0954170385 - there is plenty of evidence to show that contact with the non-resident parent is not always in the child's best interests.
If you can't get hold of it, pm me with your email address and I'll send you a copy.
Here are the answers to the questions you asked. Yes, i reported her to the police once for attacking me with a knife, but at the time didnt want my sons mother to be arrested, thought she needed help!! she also tried to kill herself. Also I did report my wife to social services, but there was not much they could do about it as i was living there with her at the time. I was never taken seriously.
2) The guardian has become involved in our case as the court thinks my son could be getting damaged by accusations my wife is making about us and what i am saying about her. The court so far has NO idea what they are dealing with here, and keep taking pitty on her as she is self representing. The guardian will be acting on behalf of my son as he is to young to voice his opinion. She will be doing an assessment on him also. She is not speaking to me or him till October!! Then it wont be till December b4 she says she can make a decision to stop contact??
3)After false accusations I looked into everything i could with the police and social services but they said there is nothing they can do, as this needs to be brought to the attention of the court.
I wish there was something we could do because untill she gets full custody she will not stop doing this.
I have not had a chance to bring the visa subject to the attention of the court as there is no hearing till dec.. I will tell the guardian as soon as i get the chance.
I did not stop contact because there is a court order for him to go every other weekend. If we break it she calls the police saying she thinks he is in danger. He was meant to go this weekend but i called the guardian and social services to let them know he wouldnt be going. The guardian said she could not commet as such till she has looked into what is going on??? I made sure i was out, she called twice but did not contact the police. I am trying to make an emergency application to the court but I am waiting for benefits papers to come through so i can get legal aid!! I have had to now go on benefits as i have to collect and drop my little boy to school as my partner is too worried about being around him on her own. My exwife has and is slowly distroying everything. At the last hearing when i asked for contact to be stopped, the court said let the guardian look into matters and the court would make a decision in December!!!!
It just seems like the court has no idea how serious this situation is.
I would be very appreciative if you could letme know how i go though the police to get contact stopped till the next emergency hearing. Something needs to be done about this asap!!
Our life is [censored] at the moment. And are waiting for legel aid to go through.
Thank you so very much for your detailed responce.
Hi warhol,
Thanks for coming back and also your openness.
1) When you contacted the Police, did they actually log the incident/take a statement? If so i would definately request a copy of this from the Police. It is of little surprise the Police didn't take you seriously. My own circumstance my ex wife assaulted me (directly in front of my child), however being 6ft and weighing 230lb refused to action the incident. I got resolve through going to their Sergeant and having him deal with this.
2) So your Son, is currently with a guardian (i assume Court appointed and therefore is from Social Services?). If this is the case the guardian will have extended "rights" and orders through the courts. What order was last made through the courts?
3) This seems very odd. If there are assaults then this immediately becomes a criminal matter and the Police and Courts can deal with this. In instances of Civil matters, the Police cannot get involved however the Courts and Social Services can.
I will explain something about Courts Orders that is little known of. A Court Order despite being a legally binding document with penalties is rarely actioned on. This for several reasons. For example, if you are arguing to the Court that you are stopping contact with your ex over concerns relating to your Sons welfare, i see no reason why a Court would impose a penalty (financial or otherwise) in relation to this action. This provided what you have posted on here being true of course.
If your ex calls the Police following your stopping contact, you will need to contact the guardian as soon as possible to explain the situation. Having been to Court i know that it is a daunting experience. I would say you need to be very forward with the people at the Courts (Magistrates or i'm guessing in your situation a Judge) and explain your concerns and inform them that issues need dealing with now because your Childs welfare is not being taken into account (again, if what you are saying is true).
Out of interest are you keeping a diary with all conversations documented, all what you get involved in with your son and also copies of text messages?
1) I didnt think to link what happened in the past to the police thought they may have asked or somone would have said something. The police took a statement when she attacked me with the knife and yes i will get a copy of that statemnet.
2)The guardian says theres nothing they can do till they have looked into everything and will make a decision in December. The order through the courts was that he goes to his mothers everyother weekend saturday till sunday i collect him at 5pm.
3) The assults took place on me about 4 years ago. She tried at one point to take my life. Social Services say because they have closed the case on abuse allegations they do not have the authority to cancel contact although agree it should be stopped. They seem very understanding tho.
She never called the police to my suprise this weekend, which is very strange. I know now she is planning something big for me. Yes i willdo my best to be forward with the courts, they are acting like they have all the time in the world. My son is at his worst i have ever seen and now having his old eating issues back (ones he had when she took care of him) hiding food, throwing forks..., refusing to eat. Its hard to stay on top of it. He was almost hospitalised at one point when she left our home as he would only consume sweets, cakes... a diet she found easiest instead of giving him propper meals.
I know i need to stress the seriousness of what she is doing at the first moment i can to the court.
I am keeping logs of events of his behaviour, times she has been late collecting him sometimes up to 2 hours, any thing i can. Problem is there is no communication between myself and my ex wife, she does not talk to me about anything, how his weekends been/what he has eaten, she does not even ask how his weeks been?? or what new school he attends?? With the allegations she says nothing i have to hear it second hand when she has made them. She says nothing. I know this sounds too much to be true, i undersatand why you say if this is true, but really there is soooo much more that she has done in the past mind games, lies to cafass the list goes on. This is all true!
Thanks again for your support it helps. 😳
1) I didnt think to link what happened in the past to the police thought they may have asked or somone would have said something. The police took a statement when she attacked me with the knife and yes i will get a copy of that statemnet.
2)The guardian says theres nothing they can do till they have looked into everything and will make a decision in December. The order through the courts was that he goes to his mothers everyother weekend saturday till sunday i collect him at 5pm.
3) The assults took place on me about 4 years ago. She tried at one point to take my life. Social Services say because they have closed the case on abuse allegations they do not have the authority to cancel contact although agree it should be stopped. They seem very understanding tho.
She never called the police to my suprise this weekend, which is very strange. I know now she is planning something big for me. Yes i willdo my best to be forward with the courts, they are acting like they have all the time in the world. My son is at his worst i have ever seen and now having his old eating issues back (ones he had when she took care of him) hiding food, throwing forks..., refusing to eat. Its hard to stay on top of it. He was almost hospitalised at one point when she left our home as he would only consume sweets, cakes... a diet she found easiest instead of giving him propper meals.
I know i need to stress the seriousness of what she is doing at the first moment i can to the court.
I am keeping logs of events of his behaviour, times she has been late collecting him sometimes up to 2 hours, any thing i can. Problem is there is no communication between myself and my ex wife, she does not talk to me about anything, how his weekends been/what he has eaten, she does not even ask how his weeks been?? or what new school he attends?? With the allegations she says nothing i have to hear it second hand when she has made them. She says nothing. I know this sounds too much to be true, i undersatand why you say if this is true, but really there is soooo much more that she has done in the past mind games, lies to cafass the list goes on. This is all true!
Thanks again for your support it helps. 😳
I will explain something about Courts Orders that is little known of. A Court Order despite being a legally binding document with penalties is rarely actioned on. This for several reasons. For example, if you are arguing to the Court that you are stopping contact with your ex over concerns relating to your Sons welfare, i see no reason why a Court would impose a penalty (financial or otherwise) in relation to this action.
I can back this up - I stopped contact between my daughter and my ex for about 4 months while I went back to court to get the contact order varied. My solicitor wrote to hers explaining that I was doing this, and why. When I got back to court, it was never even mentioned. You just need to make sure that it is documented to your ex (via her solicitor) that you are doing it and your reasons - if she calls the police, show them a copy of letter and evidence of application to the court. As long as you can justify to the court that you were acting in the children's best interests, I wouldn't expect the court to do anything at all, or at worst you'd get a few stern words.
Thats positive news. That gives me much more confidence. I think as my ex wife has no legal representation she thinks she can do what she likes. I am certain that i will continue to stop this contact till i can get an emergency hearing, or at least untill that guardian listens to what is going on. Thanks for that
In which case, I would suggest that since you will be notifying her directly, all letters are sent via registered mail, and keep all postal receipts. Personally, I would refuse to communicate an any way other than by letter, partly because you have a record of what's said, and partly because writing a letter forces you to think more carefully about what you are saying, whereas firing of a quick email or text can lead you to say something you may regret later.
Just updating all on how the situation is going... unfortunately, not so good. 2 contacts have passed, without my son seeing his mother until a court date has been arranged. The 1st missed contact my partner and I including the kids made sure we were out, but this weekend just gone we had ANOTHER welfare check in the evening, although my x was informed legally that contact will be stopping due to social services concerns. Welfare check was done. Today we went to the police station to file for harassment the police said that they would give my x and her partner a call explaining that if things continue like this they will take things further. My x wife or her current partner didnt take the call seriously as we were there when it was made. And it turns out they LIED about the last allegation!? About taking my son to a police station and taking pics of his arm?? This is madness, they were making excuses to why there was no record of them ever being in the station. Which means they got my 5 year old son to lie to me about going to the police station. On Thurs I finally get to see my sons guardian to tell them what has been going on. I really hope I get heard and they believe how crazy these people are because I cant live my life on egg shells wondering when the next allegations are going to be. Ideally I would like the guardian/court to stop contact for good. But this seems unlikely as i have never been taken seriously since we went to court. The court take sympathy on her as she acts thick and is self representing.
My partner is now telling me she cant put her daughter through these allegations any more and is worried how far my ex will go and there is nothing i can do to re assure her.
Please any advice welcome- once again my post is ALL THE TRUTH (I wouldn't wish what we are going through on anyone) The fact they are now having the cheek to lie to the police about going to the police station with my son is worrying me so much- I dont understand why no one seems to take this seriously?? They are clearly getting away with doing what ever they feel like. Ill keep you up dated and wish me luck for Thus. 😕
Thanks 😕 ?
Just updating all on how the situation is going... unfortunately, not so good. 2 contacts have passed, without my son seeing his mother until a court date has been arranged. The 1st missed contact my partner and I including the kids made sure we were out, but this weekend just gone we had ANOTHER welfare check in the evening, although my x was informed legally that contact will be stopping due to social services concerns. Welfare check was done. Today we went to the police station to file for harassment the police said that they would give my x and her partner a call explaining that if things continue like this they will take things further. My x wife or her current partner didnt take the call seriously as we were there when it was made. And it turns out they LIED about the last allegation!? About taking my son to a police station and taking pics of his arm?? This is madness, they were making excuses to why there was no record of them ever being in the station. Which means they got my 5 year old son to lie to me about going to the police station. On Thurs I finally get to see my sons guardian to tell them what has been going on. I really hope I get heard and they believe how crazy these people are because I cant live my life on egg shells wondering when the next allegations are going to be. Ideally I would like the guardian/court to stop contact for good. But this seems unlikely as i have never been taken seriously since we went to court. The court take sympathy on her as she acts thick and is self representing.
My partner is now telling me she cant put her daughter through these allegations any more and is worried how far my ex will go and there is nothing i can do to re assure her.
Please any advice welcome- once again my post is ALL THE TRUTH (I wouldn't wish what we are going through on anyone) The fact they are now having the cheek to lie to the police about going to the police station with my son is worrying me so much- I dont understand why no one seems to take this seriously?? They are clearly getting away with doing what ever they feel like. Ill keep you up dated and wish me luck for Thus.
Hi Warhol
I can't think of any further advice for now, I think you're doing everything that you can at the moment. Good luck on Thursday
Hi there v stressful day yesterday. Was in there a very long time with guardian, i presented all the evidence i had, letters from social services about they are concerned about what his mother and her partner are doing, also the fact we visited the police and they are looking at harrasment,even the letter to say contact was stopped and they still sent police round to do welfare check BUT...none of this even caught the attention of the guardian. Its crazy. She said basically they are very convincing, and that she STILL WANTS CONTACT TO CONTINUE?? Its in the best interest of my son, he needs to see his mother and not to made feel like he has done something wrong.
Im gutted. I wanted her advice how to stop these false allegations there was nothing. Im seeing family justice centre today. Im at wits end. We also discussed the fact my son may be better off living with them, in an attempt to stop these allegations...At this point I reaslise I have LOST. There is no hope for my son. I have no other option but to consider this now.I still am denying contact no matter what guardian says till something has been arranged for my son and to safe guard us all. A family physcologist has to interview my son, me and my partner, guardian is going to his school also to talk to him and there is going to be an emergency hearing as i AM REFUSING TO LET THEM SEE HIM. I cant understand because they are good liars they get to distroy my life- im walking on egg shells at the moment paranoid in every sence of the word!!! The next contact is meant to be next weekend- and i will not let him go with them for them to make more allegations and lies about us. Should my partner move out to safe guard her self from all of this, she says she wants to as she is worried sick, not sleeping... but if they dont see him how can they make any more allegations.
PLEASE HELP
Hi Warhol,
Thanks for keeping us up to date. This story does sound very far fetched to say the least, but as i stated even if it is only half true its still very serious.
I would highly recommend you take the following steps immediately:
- Ask the Guardian for their details and explain that you are now making a formal complaint
- Ask the Guardian to whom they are directly responsible too and who is the Manager
- Contact the Courts to explain that due to total inaction on issues regarding a Childs Protection, Welfare and Safeguarding issues you have persistently been raising, you are now going to be contacting the Childrens Minister (Tim Loughton who is Children and Families Minister)
- Contact your MP whomever that may be and include a copy of this letter to Tim Loughton)
You will need to construct a sound, solid letter of both complaint and desperation. Tim Loughton can be contacted through http://www.timloughton.com .
A big part of me wishes that this event isn't happening at all and if indeed it is, your Child is going to have some serious repercussions later in life down to i'm sorry to say two parties. The Mother for her consistent abuse and in some respects warhol you not acting with enough force to push matters forward.
Obviously as i've stated persistently this is a very serious nature and although i will continue to be interested in the outcome i have to say the outcome for this Child is now almost certain in both the short term and long term. If what you are saying is true, the mother should be having an Order of No Contact made against her, as clearly this is distressing the child immensely on some level.
Thank you for you message. I know this is so serious, infortunatly my solicitor cant help me as legal aid has not come through??
She says she cant help at the moment but will let me know as soon as she gets legal aid.
Cafcas i have written a position statement to in March 2010 before allegations there was No reply.
I read something yesterday on line while searching for an answer to this and found
(I am now copying and pasting)
I just tried wont let me copy and past so am typing from what i see.
There is a very good chance that the person you complain about will be dealing with the complint. They will hold any complaint against you with purputuity.
For a long time there was no complaints system at all, now there are only certain things you can complain about,the allegations you are making will not be converd in their complaints systems and have to be brought up in court, then the court says you have to talk to cafcass.
This explains why my position statement was a waste of time and energy!
If you want to know more pm me, Im a little worried about saying too much on line as i dont know who is reading, i will do as you say and my best to get it done as qucik as possible for all our sakes. Thanks so very much for all comments in box and on the board.
P.S I understand you have to talk about even if half of this is true. It is ALL true. We are living every day in fear. EVERY DAY!
Thus was the biggest let down we had so much evidence, we cant focus on anything other than this.
Thanks again
Hi warhol,
You don't need to raise legal aid in order for you to start the process moving through.
Given the apparent inaction by all parties, you now need to start making the motions to avert some of the damage that is upcoming to your child.
You don't need legal aid in order to start requesting information, you don't need this to contact or file complaints to the courts, MP's etc. These are all things which you should be doing now.
If you wish any further help in what and how to go about it i can give pointers. Legal aid doesn't forbid you from writing letters or acting on your own back. If you are self represented or not you have the right in law to act on your own.
Thank you for that. I have composed a letter to the court I hope it is composed in the correct way. I am also calling my loacl mp this week for an appointment as I see he has a weekly surgery. I will also put everything into a letter like you suggested earlier and send to both mps. In regards to complianing to cafcass I hope you read what I wrote in an earlier post and I feel that, that will be the case. When I presented all the evidence she looked but said i cant do anything till all is filed with the court- therefore contact should continue. She even said that because they are so convincing its hard to see who is telling the truth, although my son has had many welfare checks and EVERY TIME he is fine, and although social services have said he is fine?????
Anyway appreciated as much as ever for your help with this. I hope one day I can post some good news on this site!?
Many Thanks
Can you explain what you mean by I dont need legal aid to start requesting information?
Its just that some of the things I have asked police for when i called them on friday- like repots of welfare checks (to also be used as proof)... they say only a solicitor can request them. My solicitor is NOT helping me much right now as she keeps saying I dont have legal aid yet. She is however trying to call guardian on Monday to find out a bit more...but dont hold any hope that it will happen or there will be any develpments.
But again im going to try and do all you have suggested from monday.
Thanks
Hi warhol,
I have been trying to call and have sent a PM.
For the legal aid that is to deal with the issue at hand. There is no law which says you cannot proceed with a private grievance against any issue which you have. There are avenues for requesting documentation without a solicitor however if you forward a complaint to the court explaining this documentation they can access these. The Childrens Legal Centre could potentially give more clear instructions as to how to do this.
You can call the guardian to ascertain this information. As a guardian they are obliged to give you (the parent) this information (relating to their line manager).
You can personally start writing letters to the Courts witha complaint and also attach these to both your MP and Tim Loughton. MP's have a lot of weight to throw.
Latest update on situation....Last week I decided to send a four page letter to my local MP and the Childrens minister Tim Loughton in a desperate attempt to be heard. I've also written to the courts expessing my concerns. Two days later I received a reply from my local MP 🙂 He said that I had supplied sufficiently detailed information for him to raise my concerns with the chief executive of Cafcass. Since then I have also had another reply from the MP saying Cafcass have advised they will be making enquires and will respond within two weeks. This definitely gives me some hope. For the past three months this experience has had massive implications on my sons mental state, drained the life out of my partner and I and shattered family life. I have battled to give my son strength through this most difficult time of his and my partner has showed courage and support that brought new confidence into his life, but it has so quickly been destroyed since overnight stays and the allegations. I've had to consistently protect and safeguard my family from the cruelty of this allegations. I feel that I was backed into a corner of immense pressure I couldn't get out of...I have a hopeless situation where my son is seriously suffering and regressing through physcologicial abuse and disregard to his mental well-being at his mothers and then another danger where he could lose possibly lose ME through further false allegations. All I ever wanted is to be a good father for him??!? At least now there could be some light at the end of the tunnel. The question is this ; Are Cafcass prepared to label me unstable through no fault of my own yet also prepared, given the hard evidence, risk my son having continued overnight contact or even residency in a mentally disadvantaged, damaging and dangerous environment? Are they prepared to say something should have been done at an earlier stage in court proceedings to have stopped this situation getting to the stage it is at now and putting my son at risk? How is it fair that Cafcass officers see the participants of family law proceedings for only a limited time yet they make recommendations which have far reaching and possible damaging consequences for a child? I will wait until I have had a response. If I'm not satisfied and contact resumes as normal I will start preparing all the evidence I have in defence of the letter I sent the MP about how I have been ignored by Cafcass throughout. This will include.....
*I'm in process of getting statement from my solicitor on a phone conversation she had with the Cafcass officer a few months ago that involves notions of racial discrimination. That because my x is of ethnic minority and without legal assistance, she is at a disadvantage. That because I'm white British male with legal help..I have too much advantage and have made her look like the victim in all this?!? Very biased judgement.
*Substancial evidence that the reports have been v.one sided and not neutral in context. That there have been inaccuracies, incomplete information and non independant views contained in the reports.
*The handling of the first allegation in July was inappropriate and inadequate. The video taken of my son was witheld by Cafcass for a period of time and I have still not seen it. Why didn't they make an earlier referral? There was no correspondence by the Cafcass officer with myself around the allegations and none since?. I'm also in process of getting another statement from the barrister representing me on the day of the final hearing. In conversation with the Cafcass officer for 45mins she was only told of the allegations as we walked into the court room. Why was I left in the dark until the last minute? And why were the allegations timed so perfectly to coincide with the final hearing?
*A position Statement written by myself back in March was totally ignored. I expressed my fears that my son could be subject to abuse, the proposals for contact to increase to overnight caused me to worry with great reason. Those fears back then have now become a sad reality and my son is now suffering..so why wasn't I listened to and why was there no fact-finding after supplying my evidence in my original statement?!
*Mediation meeting..On countless occasions I asked the Cafcass officer to arrange a meeting with both parties to facilitate parental care and relationship building. This meeting could have eased some of the issues preventing harmonious relationships between both parties and given both sides a chance to voice there concerns. It was essential this meeting took place. It would have given this case a much needed mediator but it failed to happen. I now have evidence in the form of a statement that The Cafcass officer has said to my x that my partner and I REFUSED to attend such a meeting....?
*My voicemails have never been acknowledged and I have never been able to contact my Cafcass officer since the allegations, yet she is happy to correspond with my x's partner.
My confidence in the entire Cafcass process has been reduced to zero. All I can hope for is I am finally listened to and the most important victim in all of this..my son..and my family benefit a much healthier life.
I'm also considering writing to Jo Frost @supernanny to voice my concerns over this whole situation and if need be making a complaint to the ombudsman for children. I'll keep you posted........
Hi warhol,
I did call and speak with your partner the other night and not sure as to how much has been relayed back...
Well done for taking the first [of many] steps toward actually getting a suitable and safe result for your son.
In response to your questions:
1) CAFCASS are unlikely to be able to "label" you as unstable, given the evidence which i have seen here seems most unlikely given that there have been many occurrences of instability owed to your ex
2)They should have indeed acted much much sooner
3) They can only act on procedures outlined (and usually backed by law) however some of these procedures should be considered be changed in light of the situation you have gone through
In relation to the CAFCASS response:
Racial Discrimination, imo the CAFCASS officer has acted in a very biased way simply because of that comment. It should be brought directly down to the child. The parents do of course come into it however her being a foreign national or not has and holds no bearing to the case unless there is a perceived link relating to cultural or religious threat notions (i.e. Victoria Climbie).
Reports do no have to follow neutrality. They can be based on both fact and opinion and so while they may be negative, you could highlight that the report contains no mention of things that your ex has done.
I explained to your partner particularly about this video as memory serves and that evidence cannot be simply sprang on or into a Family related matter in court. I explained that i had every point raised as being detrimental about me and my parenting in my ex-wifes statement and i could not bring out family pictures to show my involvement. It was just not allowed as the other party i was informed quite sternly by a legal advisor, "needed to be shared with all parties concerned in plenty of time".
To be honest warhol i wouldn't bother writing to Jo Frost, a more suitable point of contact may be newspapers/the press and continuing to press Ministers for action.
Well done, hopefully within the next 6-8months you'll be posting as a certified resident parent 🙂
Hi Warhol
Sounds like some progress at last. I agree entirely with Yoji about not contacting Supernanny at this stage. I believe that you can't legally disclose proceedings in a family court to anyone except to persons directly concerned with the welfare of a child or your legal representative (MPs are allowed) without a courts permission, so if you did contact her, you could be in contempt of court
Hi all at dads talk. Firstly just want to say the help and support on here is amazing, and you got me and my partner through some very tough times. A genuine thank you.
Secondly- updating you all on the situation. In 2 words NOT GOOD!
1) Letter back from MP stating the obvious, about the situation and Cafcass clearly were not interested.
2)I have been told that now a letter to the court has been written to discuss residency to his mother as i said in the interview sometimes it feels the only way to stop the allegations and putting him through this is to let him go to live with her. They jumped on this.
3) Child protection came round as is turns out they did take my son to the police again, and pics were taken of his arm of 1 mark!? Child protection dropped the allegations straight away saying again malicious. Few more accounts they will be arrested. They went off to look at if they can give them a good talking to and i have heard nothing since?? This was about 3 weeks ago 😕
4)No sign of emergency hearing, looks like we will have to avoid contact to next court hearing which is not until DECEMBER!!!!!
5) its now nearly 3 months that contact has been stopped.
6) Last week I was told that its clear his mother and her partner are satisfied with the destruction they brought upon us, they have now just moved into a 3 bedroom house in preparation for my son going to live with them.
7)They must not have any idea how my family is coping right now. We have been to [censored] and are still there, everyday is a constant reminder of what they have done to us, seeing my sons behavioural problems...these people should be locked up
Hi warhol,
Not going well at the moment...
Erm... to respond:
- For the letter back from your MP what were the actual points addressed? CAFCASS not interested? They certainly should be in that there is a clear Safeguarding issue. I would be very tempted to write a strongly worded letter on your behalf to CAFCASS, and of course provided proof can be demonstrated.
- For this letter at Court and their jumping on the application for Residency, i would include that this whole issue is down to the Courts inability to act, to take a lead and actually deal with the attitude and contempt emanating from your ex-wife
- I would contact the courts regarding police action to seek a disbarrment order/restraining/harassment order
- Am i right in thinking that you have had no contact with your son in 3months?
- Who told you point 6?
- I would definately agree. Write to your MP again and state that action needs to happen.
I do believe you have pretty much the worst situation that i have ever read about relating to the Child...
I agree with Yoji. I've been using this forum for about a year and this appears to be the worst situation I have seen. Or heard about. Ever.
Looking over the threads I can see that you pro-actively stopped contact with the mother, because of the detrimental effect her behaviour was having on your son? This appears to have happened at the end of Sep '11? So there has been no contact for just under two months?
The points that Yoji has made are valid and are legitimate arguments to bring up in court. I seem to recall that you were waiting for confirmation of Legal Aid, which is why your solicitor hasn't been able to deal with this matter on your behalf. Has this come through? Or have you dispensed with your solicitor?
If your MP has actually stated that in his opinion CAFCASS are not interested in investigating your complaint, then this surely reinforces your argument against CAFCASS? What is it, exactly, that he has said?
I've been reading your previous posts and there's quite a bit of inconsistency in some of them, which makes it really difficult to offer accurate advice. I know this is easier said than done, but it really will serve you better to take a step back and seperate the actual facts about what is happening from the assumtions that you're making in moments of emotional duress.
I sincerely hope that matters work out for the benefit of both you and your son.
It says that this is a complex case. That the guardian working on it, is aware of how bad things are and is in deep thought about what to suggest. My son’s welfare is the top priority in this...that’s why when she interviewed him my father was present. She knows how concerned I am, it’s a lot of rambling, nothing ever explained, sentences that have double meanings- It just doesn’t mention anything about anything. Also fails to mention why there has been a letter sent to the court to discuss residency at next hearing. Its content consists of many generalisations relating to the organisation, what they stand for....
The covering letter from mp, said this is their response, I hope this helps, he made no suggestion or didn’t give any thoughts on this letter, just said if you need to contact me further please do. I have not responded.
To make things clear I stopped contact because of 2nd false allegations, even tho cafcass said not to.
I know they have moved because my solicitor told me. I don’t feel comfortable talking on here because I know they know I use this site. Let’s just say my solicitor is USELESS right now legal aid has not come through.... sometimes she is willing to help me sometimes she is not. I sometimes wonder whose side she is on. 😈
I’m worried about anyone writing a letter on my behalf, it seems the more I try to complain the worse things get for my son. They do not take anyone seriously and you can’t get any proper information from them they dance around issues and say they understand how you must be feeling, I feel I’m at a dead-end.
In regards to harassment I have tried to go to the police on MANY occasions, they say there is not enough on them! I can’t do anything against them.
Hope this is enough info.
One more thing, my son is with me, has not seen his mother for nearly 3 months. I dont want him put through police visits welfare checks, S.S involvement. Every other weekend we have to make sure we are out from very early on Saturday to late Sunday evening to avoid them. They still sometimes turn up to try and get him, call me... even though they had a letter saying contact was stopped till a next hearing. It is all very tough. A few weeks ago they desperately tried to go to my mothers and would not go away, I Was not there, she called police after, went to the station, again they said if this happens again then they can be charged with harassment.
Looks like we will be having to do this till December as that's when next court hearing is. There has been no emergency hearing at all! 😥
Hi Warhol,
It certainly is a complex case. I would contact your MP directly and explain that you are not happy with the length of this decision and that you feel CAFCASS are not following in their duty. I would explain that you have evidence that your son (at least as far as we on here have been told) is at serious risk of abuse from being in your ex's care and that you need support from the Courts in brining about a stable environment for your son.
You need to be more forceful on this one. Courts aren't a place that will strike you down for wanting to know answers. They are people in there just like you. If your ex knows that you frequent this site, you will need to be careful with the situations what you are describing... how did she find out about you using this site?
I would go on to explain that you feel that an Order needs to come to Court at the earliest opportunity.
I would re-instate contact with your Son immediately. He needs to have some consistency maintained. If your ex comes around, call the Police immediately and inform that you want them gone and then i would proceed with a harassment order and prohibitive steps order.
Re-instate your contact. That is your first priority.
With regards to your MP, I would make an appointment at his constituency surgery to see him, rather than just write, but have a summary of the whole matter written down to give to him at the meeting so that nothing is missed.
Thanks for the advice in regards to
what you worte...I would re-instate contact with your Son immediately. He needs to have some consistency maintained. If your ex comes around, call the Police immediately and inform that you want them gone and then i would proceed with a harassment order and prohibitive steps order.
I can not let contact continue!! He lives with me, She tries to see him with her twisted partner everyother weekend.
Anyway got a call today, court hearing monday! Solicitor told me and my legal aid is through although I had to pay a sum towards it, or no barrister! Anyway that's being sorted.
I would have got a meeting with mp but Monday is so soon, i wrote him a letter explaining everything and i was not happy shocked and let down. I Explained to him that cafcass now wants to give residency to mother and let contact continue with her asap!! I have asked him to put in writing that he thinks she should be in a contact centre till an investigation is done on her. Its a detailed letter including a letter which i wrote to cafcass warning them about what my x was capable of, that cafcass ignored! I hope he will help. Im also seeing my doctor tomorrow, the one that has to check my son for marks everyother week and im going to beg her to put in writing also that this woman goes to a contact centre till something is sorted. I have contacted a contact centre also to get prices and dates of when they could have a contact session asap ill bring this with me also to court and explain that this is where she needs to be!!
I'm bringing everything I can. I'm worried. Any more advice guys??
**about others reading, when I wrote to mp last time I told him that you guys on here had supported me and my family, there is every chance that cafcass could have found this out,and passed on info to his mother...( i know they would do that) it wouldn't be hard to pick this case out from all the others!!**
Hi warhol,
I see, i misunderstood then... i was under the impression that your son lived with a court appointed guardian who allowed contact between both yourself and your ex. I was also under the impression that you had stopped having contact with your son. This then implies that when you have contact your ex just turns up.
If you have custody of your Son... you are right in my opinion to withhold contact from your ex given that there is a clear welfare and safeguarding issue when it comes to your son.
If any contact is occurring then i would definately agree 100% with you in that any contact she has needs to be supervised.
Well done warhol... now that you have posted i have to say that as you are witholding contact i honestly think that things are actually getting better. How is your son doing?
HI there, thanks again for the support and advice. I had an emergency hearing on Friday. I didnt get into trouble for stopping contact for all that time. The judge seemed to understand the seriousness of allegations, although continued contact! she put an order in place that if his mother she needs to talk to me first and discuss, which his mother and her partner were far from happy about. If they go straight to police i am told this will be dismissed. The hearing was only down for 10mins we were in for 45. I explained that I never said for my son to have residency that this must have been a misunderstanding. I was told that there will be another court hearing to see how the 1 contact went in btween that time. The position statement i wrote was very good but not read but will be at next court hearing, where I will get a chance to discuss all of my concerns and still push for a contact centre. My mp wrote to me today and said he will get back onto cafcass and explain my concerns again and that I was not happy with the last reply they sent me, in an attempt to shut me up. I have also taken your advice and got an appointment with him. He has been very good, and is trying. so my father will go with me. We feel safer now there is something in place,and also my son will continue to be checked by a doc b4 he goes to them and when he gets back! Unfair on him I know, but next hearing i will be pushing for a contact centre as they cant be trusted. To answer your question, my son is not bad considering...still gets angry, attempts to control people by refusing to eat, but he has not asked about his mother and and seems to be slowly getting better!listening, being happy for longer periods of time and has stopped hitting me! I have learnt from when she first left him, that you have to stay strong for children, dont give in, support them and be clear with what you expect from them, which is what I do- although DRAINING. I know he could be an amazing child if away from his mother or minimised contact- when she didnt see him for months when she left he really came on- I was able to take him out and enjoy things, rather than having a constant short fused child that wanted his own way 24/7, he was and is always used to being the boss around her, he had no respect for her and her none for him .... I could go on as you know!
Thanks guys for being here for my family, don't know what we would have done without you.
Will keep you posted!
Hi warhol,
Thats fantastic news. There is always a light at the end of the tunnel.
Just a few other questions:
1) As you have submitted a Position statement... has your ex returned her Position Statement to/for you? (I know you said it didn't get read at the Emergency hearing (this is normal btw))
2) What Contact or level of Contact will you stipulate to happen for the Contact centre? Is this something you have thought about or considered?
3) Did the Judge mention any such decision regarding the further Police involvement or was it just as you say: "this will be dismissed"?
I honestly think you can give yourself a big pat on the back! Like i say don't take any flack that you aren't willing to but keep it calm and composed.
Good luck with the information from your MP and hopefully something will be forthcoming from CAFCASS.
Of course, any other questions and i and others will be happy to help.
1) As you have submitted a Position statement... has your ex returned her Position Statement to/for you? (I know you said it didn't get read at the Emergency hearing (this is normal btw))
2) What Contact or level of Contact will you stipulate to happen for the Contact centre? Is this something you have thought about or considered?
3) Did the Judge mention any such decision regarding the further Police involvement or was it just as you say: "this will be dismissed"?
Thank you, yes it feels a little better. My ex had nothing, they asked where her 1st one was and her barrister had to say it was not done properly so she would have to do another. Anyway he is allowed to correct it and give it in to court. She has not done a recent one..her and her partner were upset as they are going to have to pay a contribution towards a psychological assessment for my son, should be any time this month Cafcass are trying to get this done fast.
I will ask for 3 hours supervised every other week.
The judge just said it would be dismissed but I will try and further this on the next hearing as to ask for when would it be seen as wasting police time?
My x also tried to get time with him at xmas! I said no, but court said i should think about this and discuss at next hearing, I have decided to let her have a few hours on 23rd. Next court date 5th DEC lets hope they can behave themselves till then!
Hi warhol. I personally think that allowing the contact you have outlined is a wise move as the court has obviously suggested you think about it, meaning that if you don't allow it, you'd better have a [censored] good reason to give them. Doesn't mean that you can't place reasonable (ie you can justify your reasons to court) restrictions on the contact when it does happen, and if your ex doesn't agree, then she's the one who has turned down contact. Always pays to stay on the good side of the court.
It does appear that things are now moving forward in a much more positive manner for you than in previous months.
What is happening regarding the Guardian? Is she expected to deliver her report on the 5th December? Or will you receive something in advance? I note that your legal aid has come through and that you are now represented by a solicitor. Given your experience to date, and your MP's current involvement in the matter, I would make sure that you provide your solicitor with a detailed account of all discussions and contact with the Guardian, and also make sure that they are aware of the involvement of your MP. You, your solicitor and your MP need to be on the same page with this and transparent communication will be key to a positive outcome.
What has your solicitor advised regarding the issue of the false allegations? Are they taking a proactive stance on this to reduce the risk of it happening again?
ACTD has made a really good point about contact. You need to be reasonable with the court, but, given the circumstances, it's perfectly understandable that you would only expect contact to happen on a supervised basis.
Do you now feel better supported and advised as a result of having legal representation? The wait for legal aid can be a long and stressful. The frustration this creates is often incalcuable, but it does appear that the tide is now turning for you 😀
Hi there there, thanks for your reply. Sorry I have taken so long to come back. The court hearing is on Friday this week. Im now being told by my solicitor that it is only to discuss when they will see him at xmas? They want xmas day i imagine! We are trying to sort it out through solicitors but if we dont agree then its court first thing on fri. I doubt we will agree as they have always been very greedy (my ex wife and her new parter) Thats what got us into this mess!
The guardian does not give any final reports until the final hearing in May!!??
The appointment with mp is on the 19th December and yes thanks my solicitor does know and she says i have legal aid now. I dont know what the mp can do. When we got the other letter back from Tim L children's minister he said it was a court issue and could not get involved? I think he knows the state of the system and doesn't want reminding ! (Please see your inbox I have posted you something )
Hope I answered all questions fully. Pls give me your thoughts on what I have posted you. There is so much of this online- there is an entire new meaning to all of this now.
Thanks
I cant seem to find how I message you into your personal inbox?
If there is a way pls let me know. The information I have found is very serious and I dont think the managers of this site would take kindly to me posting it on here. Its the truth about Family Courts something very interesting I discovered.
Here is something that I read. (This is not what i want to pm you-this is something that I thought was interesting and wanted to share)
The Twilight Facts
The horrors of Cafcass the Children and Family Court Advisory Support Service.
1.The majority of Cafcass Officers are EX PROBATION OFFICERS used to dealing with hardened/petty criminals.
2.1 in 7 Cafcass officers as NOT RECEIVED ANY TRAINING.
3.Cafcass officers have NO FORMAL QUALIFICATIONS.
4.Shockingly, Cafcass officers training consists of just one 2 half-day course – less than a Traffic Warden. There is NO OFFICIAL TRAINING BUDGET whatsoever.
5.Cafcass has NO defined guidelines and in 2007 still NO PROPER COMPLAINTS PROCEDURE.
6.Cafcass KEEP NO RECORDS AND DO NOT RESEARCH INTO THE OUTCOMES OF THE CASES they have been involved in (e.g. figures on children's suicide and teenage pregnancy five years after CAFCASS involvement). This means they have NO way of knowing whether they are achieving the best outcomes for children and their parents.
7.To further compound problems, MASSIVE NUMBERS OF CWOS ARE LEAVING because of these problems. Cafcass faces a major recruitment crisis.
8.According to Dr Buchanan, ex-Head of the Family Division Research Team at Oxford University, CAFCASS HANDLES AROUND 40,000 CASES EACH YEAR affecting an estimated 80 – 120,000 children per annum.
9.This equates to OVER A MILLION CHILDREN in the past decade alone.
10.According to Dame Elizabeth Butler-Sloss, once President of the Family Division, 40% OF FATHERS LOSE CONTACT WITH THEIR CHILDREN AFTER 2 YEARS.
Hi Warhol, no idea how to access any PM's at the moment :s lol.
CAFCASS stuff is pretty much bob on however any CAFCASS worker who is involved in the Courts process (i.e. has active involvement within Cases going to court) should be registered with the GSCC (General Social Care Council) and yes, in effect are social workers.
Those figures seem as though they are from the Fathers 4 Justice book too.
The rates for children meaningful contact for a father is about that and interestingly down to race, 50% of black children are unlikely to have any form of meaningful contact with their Father.
If actd comes along i'm sure he can give some help for the PM side of things 🙂
Glad that it is slowly starting to come together. With regard to Tim Loughton although he cannot legally get involved as Childrens Minister he should actually be looking into the lack of action from the CAFCASS front imo. They are afterall there to represent the child. Their inaction so far has failed from what i and others have been reading.
Just be wary about anything over Christmas and as others have said its good to actually be willing to allow some contact however at Court i would definately have your solicitor draw up some guidelines you want following i.e. what time your Son will be picked up and dropped off need to be adhered to and others.
>If actd comes along
If? Surely you mean 'when' - I'm never far away, lol.
The admins are looking into PMs on the new forum, so hopefully that will be along in due course - this forum does allow you to add your Facebook username into your profile - that would allow you to use FB messaging as a temporary workaround perhaps. Of course, we don't want you moving away from here though, as the forum is the best place for helping lots of people learn from everyone elses experiences.
I'm surprised about the stats for Cafcass - I would imagine (though I could be wrong) that cafcass officers must be trained in a suitable area even if there is no formal Cafcass qualification, there's no reason why people trained and qualified in other areas couldn't do the job without significant further training.
The personal message function appears to have disappeared as a result of the redevelopment of the site, but I'm hoping this is just an oversight. I would think that ACTD will look into this and let people know.
I'm unsure of the best way of arranging contact at Christmas. Obviously you want to show the court that you are willing to be reasonable, but given that you - understandably - only want your ex to have supervised contact I'm not sure how this can be accomodated through a contact centre. Are they even open over the festive period? If they are then you could obviously book a couple of hours on Christmas Day, but I'd assume there's a massive demand for this service and it may be too late to organise something.
What does your solicitor suggest?
The personal message function appears to have disappeared as a result of the redevelopment of the site, but I'm hoping this is just an oversight. I would think that ACTD will look into this and let people know.
Hi all,
This is all a bit embarrassing - it seems a few people are under the impression that I have more powers than I actually have. I'm a moderator on here, which means I'm on here on a regular basis, along with other moderators, to make sure that questions get answered and can call on the experts where necessary to come and assist.
The real work has been done by the admins (the ones whose names appear in scarlet) - they've put in lots of work to get this forum and the whole website up and running in the first place and keep it running, and refresh it. They are the (sometimes silent) heroes of this place 🙂
HI there i think its going to be a few hours on 23rd as i have booked a docs appointment to ensure he is well and happy b4 he goes. As far as court are concerned she doesn't have to be supervised for this! But still applies that if she has any worries or complaints she has to speak to me directly without going to police... first! I have said she can have 3 hours on this day but if she disagrees looks like we will be fighting over that on Friday.
I would speak with your solicitor first, but I would suggest you tell the court that you ceased contact between your son and his mother due to the harmful affect her behaviour was having on him. You don't want to appear unreasonable, but given the things your ex has done - and have your solicitor list them - you would prefer to use a contact centre. If not for the period of contact, then certainly for drop off and pick up. You want to minimise the contact you have with your ex and reduce the risk of any further unpleasantness.
You haven't had any substantial legal representation until recently due to your wait for funding, but I would expect your solicitor to be pressing for some kind of restrictions around contact given the concerns that you have. In the interim this would serve to safeguard everyone involved.
The courts aren't interested in the history of squabbling parents. Most splits have an element of acrimony and the courts aren't particularly interested in what has happened before (unless they determine that it affects the welfare of the child). What they do want to know is what happens NEXT. How do they move matters forward? I think you should look at offering your ex some time on Christmas Eve, which is the 24th? It's a reasonable offer and you can state that, if she can demonstrate a willingness to address your concerns over the coming months (and stop the abuse allegations), you would be willing to re-establish contact on a stepped basis and, ultimately, look forward to next Christmas being a more stress free affair for everyone.
The key here is to let the court see that you're prepared to be reasonable, but that your main priority is safeguarding the welfare of your child. You mentioned originally that your ex had visa problems and that this was possibly the real reason for her challenge to the residency order. Has your solicitor outlined a strategy for your case bearing this in mind?
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