[Solved] An interesting one - Daughter living with me

If you apply for residency, this will give your daughter the stability she needs. Just incase Mum splits from her current partner & decides she wants her back. What does your daughter & current partner want?

Hi Rik,

Sorry to hear that things are still complicated.

You would need to apply for a residence order and go through the whole CAFCASS process again. A Residency Order is a much bigger deal than a Contact Order. If your daughter was actually living with you when you applied for the residency order, I would imagine that you'd have a stronger case. The more settled she is with you, the less likely a court would be to remove her.

I would attempt to document as much of this as possible and save all texts and emails from the mother in regards to this issue. She may just be going through a phase. I don't suppose she's turned 30 recently has she?

I guess you're not represented by a solicitor at the moment, so why don't you contact the Coram Children's Legal Centre (CCLC) for some free advice about what to do? There's a link to their website at the foot of the page...

FM '70

The CCLC are amazing re: free legal advice, via webchat/telephone, and have proved an invaluable resource to me in the preceding weeks. I was tempted to comment earlier but felt others would perhaps be better placed to offer advice - I've no doubt that you would be required to pay the £200 again, although if you'd filed both at the same time (impossible, I know) then perhaps not, but have you spoken to your ex about this? I appreciate that she may be amicable now but is she likely to react/overreact should things become official? I have been a resident father for the previous five months but, as soon as things appear to become official / legally binding, I suddenly appear to meet with unreasonable resistance as the ex doesn't like to lose (what she perceives as) control?

I'm not trying to be difficult but, if you can reach an agreement outside of the courts (I know, not always possible), then this would perhaps be advisable as court orders can be incredibly troublesome to enforce/maintain and rarely provide any element of flexibility which could potentially work/be used aganst you in the future?

Thanks guys. You've all been awesome as usual!!

The deal is that she simply thinks that my daughter will be better off here. At present she has suggested this and we've been speaking about it as much as possible.

I did tell her today that it would have to be official (IE through courts) to protect my daughter's best interest (IE not having to move again).
I feel it's best for my daughter because at present my daughter is unhappy at home. Her behaviour and attitude towards her mother is extremely irregular for a 5 year old.

I'm documenting as much as I can. I try my best to keep text messages in backups etc. I achieve this with a little bit of iOS knowhow and Excel trickery. I use Evernote to jot stuff down and iOS notes when I can't get to my Mac.

I'm not sure what I should be documenting / if I should be wary.

My current partner is extremely accepting of the situation and she cares for my daughter a great deal. In fact, my daughter looks forward to seeing her and often requests that they do things together (because i'm a boy apparently I don't understand. ha! ).

I'm just worried about, as mentioned above, the ex changing her mind later in the game.

HA! She's not turned 30 though.

All I know is that my daughter WOULD be more stable here. We've not moved for 3 years and don't plan to. My ex has moved my daughter from one end of Manchester to the other, to Grimsby and now to Leeds (both because of blokes).

I fear this, among other things is having a detrimental affect on my child.

She wants to live with us. She's told her mother this.

I've already spoken to the council RE school and HR at work about Flexible working mah woman is more than happy to drive her to school so I can get to work and then ideally I'd pick her up. We've already pretty much planned around Mollie.

Just need a decision.

I'll speak to the CCLC tomorrow!

Cheers guys!

I'm not sure what I should be documenting / if I should be wary.

The simple answer is absolutely everything - if you prepare for the worst, hopefully it will never happen, but if it does, you'll have everything to hand.

Excellent. I'll definitely keep it up then no matter how small. Cheers.

Really sorry to bump and grave dig this thread but I've lost my way with this one. Can anyone PLEASE help with the following?

Although my Ex has said she wants my daughter to live with me she will not talk about it / arrange it.

I think court might be the only answer as:

My daughter never stops talking about "Living with daddy" and she has asked me independently if she can live here without prompting and she doesn't know her mum has brought it up.

My ex kept my daughter OFF SCHOOL for a whole week so she could go "on a break" to London leaving my daughter in Manchester (she lives in Leeds) with her (full of flu) mother. My daughter was not ill (I ended up picking her up from there myself) although was not attending school. I only found out when the school phoned me!!!!

She has said on more than one occasion that she cannot provide properly for my child despite getting over £250 a month CSA (which is pending a reduction now a contact order is in place) and "working" as well as claiming.

My daughter regularly gets dressed in scruffy, too small clothes. I have to send her back in things I've bought.

My ex did not pay for a school trip because she "had no money" yet had a night club stamp on her hand (as she usually does) when I dropped My daughter off last.

She makes my daughter stay at 2 houses (hers AND her boyfriend who isn't even old enough to be a father, let alone responsible enough) over each week as well as her other child.

She has NEVER registered her with a dentist (I have done this as soon as I found out, btw).

She's destroying my daughter and I don't know what I can do.

I need her to live here but I don;'t know what I can do. Social services have been involved once by a concern raised from a third party (I think it was her sister) about stuff my daughter came out with but she manipulated them. Personally I have never been fond of them as they tend to go all or nothing on things.

I keep writing stuff down but I need to proceed.

I can't have my child in that environment any longer. Today she called me to complain the school were teaching about Eid (sp?)

Any help / advice on getting this done quickly (and cheaply if possible) would be awesome.

Cheers guys.

HI. Have you thought about having your daughter for a trail period, say a month and see how everyone feels, if all goes well then extend to another month, I know this means taking her out of her school and starting a new one. It may be worth a go !!

I have thought about this and I believe it's unfair on her as it will mean transferring schools twice and effectively being uprooted (again). Her mother has moved her about like there's no tomorrow.

I want her to feel stable and secure. I have thought about a trial and I believe this would only be beneficial over the end of year school holidays as she has moved schools very recently (twice).

I really want to give her security and stability.

If you contacted the mother and said forget about making it official we want her to come and live with us and Mollie wants it too, do you think she would agree then?
Instead of waiting for her to arrange it, why dont you suggest that next time you pick her up would be as good a time as any to keep her, ask to pick up some of her clothes and toys, put her on the spot about it. She would have to either agree or say no. At least you would have a better idea of what you're up against. If she says no then you could tell her that you are not prepared to leave it at that and you will take it to court if necassary. Remind her that Social Services would be involved if you have to apply to the court, all the moving and different schools, and the age of her boyfriend will all look bad. Tell her it would be better for everyone to come to agreement without the court intervention.
If she agrees, then take your daughter and after a couple of weeks or even sooner, apply for Residency to make it official. Once Mollie is with you the mum can change her mind all she wants, but to get her back she would have to take you to court. Do you have any proof through txts or emails that the mum asked you to take her?
Sometimes you've just got to take the bull by the horns.!
My son won residency of his 5yr old son last september... the mum phoned us (my son was living with me at the time) and asked us to come and get him because she couldnt cope anymore. She wanted him back though after a few days, and when we refused mum sent the police round. The police said they couldnt do anything because my son had parental responsibility. We immediately went to court for Residency and we were succesful...It was so worth it! My grandson is doing well at school, he's happy, well dressed and clean and he loves it!
Good luck with everything, Rik.

If you contacted the mother and said forget about making it official we want her to come and live with us and Mollie wants it too, do you think she would agree then?

That's what I've been talking to her about, well, trying to. Every time I mention it she has a go at me for badgering her even though I kinda need to know.
I can't afford a solicitor so I'd have to take her to court by myself if I had to. She told me she wants her to live with me before the beginning of school term, my daughter wants to live here. She now wants to do this after this term. Meanwhile, the 20 year old my ex is living with now has my daughter calling him "Dad". I found out about this today. Am I wrong to tell my daughter not to call him that as its rather upsetting and he was only 14 when she was born which I find a bit icky.

Hi Rik,
As Bz, says you have every right to explain to your daughter that she only has one Daddy and thats you. 🙂

As far as having your daughter live with you is concerned, its a real dilemma for you and I dont know what to advise for the best. At one point my son and I thought about offering my grandsons mum a lump sum of money....that was just before she called us to take him. We could see things were getting really bad and we were prepared to do anything to get him away from the terrrible home life he had...when she phoned for us to take him we were there within five minutes, it only lasted 3 days and then she decided she wanted him back, we refused and she sent the police, but they wouldn't intervene because my son had PR....I've read of other Dads keeping their kids, but the police have made them give the child back... thats why I'm unsure about advising you to take her on contact and not give her back.

I think you just need to keep on at her....have you thought of putting her on the spot in front of your daughter. When you get there just say Mollie wants to come with me and stay, we can do it now...that would be great wouldnt it Mollie. We'll come back and see you lots ...it sounds bad using your child in that way and not something I would usually suggest but as Mollie and your ex are all talking about it happening anyway, it might be a way of breaking this stalemate! Obviously if it gets heated then just back off and drop it... Personally I would use any tactic I could! Children are so resilient...My grandsons mum turned up with a strange woman, asking to see him, I bought him to the back door for her to say goodnight and she grabbed him out of my arms, he started screaming and trying to get out of her arms, my son came running to the door and he grabbed him, and for what seemed like ages they were each pulling him, finally my son prised him away from her....it was terrible. You would have thought my grandson would have been traumatised by it, but he was fine! All he said was mummy was naughty, then he had a glass of milk and a jaffa cake and went to bed as if nothing had happened! I suggest this tentatively and not sure I should, but I know how desperate it gets in this situation.

I don't want my child calling anyone else dad. She had done that with my ex's last partner (the father of her 2nd) and that all went tits up. A 2nd time? No! Second of all, he's not even old enough to have a 5 year old.
My ex is 26, btw...

..I have thought about just taking her as there are no official residency orders in place but I don't want to disrupt school.

My daughter missed a week of school because my ex wanted to go to London. My daughter was sent to her Nana's and school lied to as she told them she was sick. I picked her up and she was fine!

Also she has just missed a whole day this week because she couldn't bother her [censored] to check if it was teacher training or not and just assumed. She is forcing my daughter to live between 2 houses in Leeds as my ex and her boyfriend live apart. I think this is extremely unfair as she already has to deal with changing between here and there often.

There are more things too, I mean, my daughter just wants to be back home but she keeps getting moved about and missing school. I should call the social services about the school missing Etc but the other hand says that would do more harm than good. I don't know what to do besides court order for residency but I can't afford a solicitor and I know every little bit of [censored] would get brought up. I lost my notes for the first 2 years in an unfortunate backup issue. My nas drive died.

Thanks to Evernote though I can keep all this stuff in the cloud so for the last 9 months I've been using that. I'll take notes and screen shot texts on there on my various devices... Yes, I am a massive nerd, it helps. I'm unsure what constitutes a good case to have My daughter live here.

@basszebra, I haven't played it. I'm mainly on Guild Wars 2 / Dishonoured ATM. I've got a few gigs coming up so I'm spending most pod my time away from work / weekends with Mollie with a Bass in hand in a small room with 3 other dudes. Might give it a go after the gigs are done.

You could report her to the council, it would be the schools department, just have a word with them about your concerns. I doubt they would do anything but at least they would log it, you could ask them to make sure they do that. You could try contacting SS about it, but unless they think that the child is at risk they probably wouldnt take an interest. They would just say talk to the mother about it..

I hear what your saying about disrupting school but, isnt that already happening? Its better to make the changes sooner rather than later, the younger the child, the less she will be affected by the disruption. Has your daughter been in the reception class. My granson at five has only just moved up to mainstream from reception in september. My son changed his school in september. My grandson had been attending a school just down the road from the mothers house, but it was a very bad school with bad OFSTED reports etc. but at court my son had given an undertaking not to move him straightaway. He took the move in his stride made new friends immediately and is doing so well. The change hasn't affected him in any negative way at all, in fact because its a better school he's coming on in leaps and bounds now.

Going for Residency isnt a done deal unless there is serious risk to the child. I hate to say it, but I dont think on the scale of risk, that disrupted school and moving around would qualify. However she doesnt know that! How about telling her that you've looked into it and with all the information you've been gathering and missing school, moving about, the age of boyfriend etc and your daughters wishes ,which will be listened to, you will have to go to court and get residency officially, because you're not prepared to leave it to her whim any longer...call her bluff.

In my sons case, there was neglect, physical and verbal abuse, missing school, mothers drinking and the children being under SS umbrella because of risk to them, but none of this was enough, it was only when she tested positive for cocaine and the judge saw the police reports that the SS then recommended he stay with my son, more to cover themselves than anything else I think. We found out during the court case that the SS was under an improvement order for failing the children in their care and we bought this up at court as a reason why they had not acted sooner. She has another child a girl of 9, who they left with her! There have been no checks on her since the court case, nobody is looking out for her interests. Its shocking really! We tried but because we are not related we've been told we have no rights to complain about her care! Her own father complains to us, but he wont take it further because in his words..."I'm not in a position to take her in...I work" I am glad that the mother has pulled her socks up and doesnt have wild parties constantly, but her house is still like a pig sty, and there are still issues with cleanliness etc... But we still have to send my grandson there every other weekend, he often says he doesnt want to go, but he seems happy enough when my son picks him up and doesnt appear to be suffering in the way he used to.

I only tell you this to illustrate how bad it has to be before the authorities feel the need to act. With the new reforms coming things might get better in time, but its a slow process and wont move fast enough to make a difference currently. With Childrens Services funding being cut, resources are spread more thinly than ever.

Thank you.
am really sorry to hear about your situation above and I'm glad things have improved for your grandson.
My situation and my daughter's seems pale in comparison to a great deal of cases and I can appreciate that there are certain aspects of this that may mean my daughter has to remain with her mother but the simple fact is that again this weekend my daughter has said no less than 3 times that she wants to live with me and my partner.
I dropped her off this afternoon but she was making a fuss when I told her we were going to get the train.
There is a whole bunch of other stuff besides school. I often find that my daughter is wearing vests and underpants that are too small, she never seems to come to me wearing nice clothes so I believe that my ex spends a great deal of money on herself. Often I find she's going without things such as proper uniform at school / PE kit despite my ex having money to go out etc. I got told she was "too skint" to buy a PE kit and uniform. I bought 4 pinnies, 4 pairs of school pants, various polo shirts (both colours) and only asked her to buy the sweater and PE kit. That same week she had pizza hut take out twice and took her to Nando's.

I know this seems like a massive rant but it's all adding up to My ex's behaviour and treatment of my child being detrimental to her life. I'm not sure how clean her house is either but my daughter tells me that she mainly stays at my ex's boyfriend's flat anyway which is pretty tidy from what I've seen.

She's let her watch things like Family Guy before too. I get told all sorts, the worst thing I can think of though was when my daughter felt ill and was crying all night she brought her to me the next day and told me she had been ill "a bit" turns out once we got home it was a perforated ear drum. I had to take her to the hospital to get anti-biotics. My ex should have called out a doctor in the first place.

There are loads more things I could get into, she said her mum smacks her on the hand and the cheek this weekend. The thing is I can't bring this stuff up with her because if I do I get made out to be some kind of liar or I get accused of "telling her to say x, y or z".

I don't want her to miss any more school as she's missed too much already. I know it might not be ideal to aim for a clean break over a holiday ready to start a new school so I might have to accept there may be a disruption but as long as I can guarantee it's the LAST one I guess we can make up for it. :D.

I'll definitely try and talk to her RE: court etc but she never listens when I bring it up. She doesn't like it when I call her or text her about anything. It's like she wants to make out like i'm trying to force her into giving up her child but it was HER idea in the first place.

Hi Rik,

... It so wrong that she is being neglected, and very painful for you to know whats happening but not be able to make it right for her....you have every right to rant! I know how frustrated you must be feeling... all I can say is just keep at it, keep a record of everything.

Why dont you call the police and ask them what your rights are as you have PR and your daughter wants to stay with you....If they were to clarify your legal status, that might make it easier for you to make the decision to act. I've heard conflicting views on PR and the right to remove a child. As I said, in my sons case the police said he had the right to keep him because he had PR, but other fathers have been made to return their child even though they had PR...very confusing!

Thanks for keeping us posted and dont give up hope. 🙂

Thanks. I'll try and get a little more advice.

She was born in 2007 and I have my name on her birth cert / she has my last name and she doesn't go by any others nor has there ever been a request to change after I put my foot down when she referred to herself as "surname-Ex's partner's surname" when in her last school. I promptly corrected them.

I have had an awesome weekend with her and dropped her off on Sunday with her mum who wouldn't take the snow globe she made for her because she couldn't be bothered carrying it. She was late, trying to scam train fare. It's not right.

I think if I went to the courts for Residency they'd have to have a LOT of evidence and I've been advised by a solicitor to arrange this out of court and THEN file for residency. It's all very confusing but why can't it be simple if she WANTS to live with me?

It's not fair on my daughter and I think her relationship with her mother would improve if she wasn't living with her. I think deep down my ex might resent her for being mine. This wouldn't make her love my daughter any less, surely, but it'd explain a lot of things.