[Solved] Court Order V CSA

Hi dad5,

Welcome to the forum. There is a similar question on the legal eagle board here https://www.dadtalk.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=483 - regular forum user actd has a similar question - it might be worth a look.

However we understand that no two cases are exactly the same so I will ask our legal experts to look at your thread and respond to it. This could take a few days so hang in there.

Gooner

Thanks for taking the time to answer.

The other thread you referred to is not similar.

In his case he wants a court order.....in my case a court order was imposed without referring to the CSA.

dad5,

you are correct about the other thread - just reread it 😳 .

I have passed you thread details to our legal experts and they will respond.

Regards
Gooner

as I understand it (though I may be wrong - edited - see below, it seems I am wrong), the CSA have jurisdiction over the courts on maintenance except under certain circumstances (over the CSA's maximum limit, special education needs etc). I don't know too much about the new CMEC but I think the idea is that it's to try to reach a mutual agreement (seems a waste of time to me, if there was a mutual agreement, then the CSA wouldn't need to be involved at all).

Assuming I am correct, then your ex's barrister doesn't have an argument. Would be interesting to know on what grounds he doesn't accept the CSA's calculation.

So are "we" saying that the CSA have more authority than the court in the matter of child maintenance? I was really surprised and disappointed at the court order as I had a rough idea of the CSA figure.

Her barrister is fighting against going to the CSA as she has a court order that is double the amount that the CSA calculated. She also claims that the court decided on the amount based on all the circumstances. I don't agree, but my only apparent option is to appeal and that is a long and expensive process - more money will be "taken" from my kids' future.

I was under the impression that the CSA took over the child maintenance from the court when it was created - here's a link to the CSA page

http://www.csa.gov.uk/en/setup/who-can-use-csa.asp

There are clear circumstances when the CSA cannot act, but otherwise, I think that they are the last word.

I've just read your original post again - you work part time in another country. Do you still do this, and if so, where is the company based that you work for?

Dear dad5

It is unclear from your post the type of proceedings in which the order was made. A maintenance order can generally only be put in place by consent i.e. where both parties agree to a specific amount which is often of a higher level than the CSA minimum.

However, it may be possible that the order was made as part of divorce proceedings. This is not usual practice and it is more common for maintenance to be left to the Child Support Agency to assess. If the order was made as part of divorce proceedings then it may be possible for you to apply to the court to have the original order varied. You can contact your local county court to obtain the necessary forms to make an application back to the court.

If there is a court order in place then involving the Child Support Agency will not negate your duties under the court order. The Child Support Agency do not have jurisdiction over a court order and therefore it will remain active. Therefore you may end up in a position where you are liable to pay maintenance by way of court order and through the CSA in the most extreme of situations.

We would recommend that you seek independent legal advice in relation to this matter. If you do not have the order to hand then it would be beneficial for you to request a copy of the order from the court and go through the terms in detail to ascertain your liability.

We hope this information has been of use however if you need clarification on this matter then please contact the Child Law Advice Line on 08088 020 008.

Kind regards
Children’s Legal Centre

>The Child Support Agency do not have jurisdiction over a court order and therefore it will remain active.

I stand corrected on this. 🙂

This has given me food for thought, so a question here for the Children's Legal Centre.

As you will may have gathered, I have been involved in a battle to try to get maintenance for my children through the CSA. However, in the original divorce settlement, there was a consent order for maintenance in which I agreed to pay maintenance to her for the children, using the CSA formula (but not deducting for travel and step daughter, and continuing until the end of university). When I took the children away from her, I stopped paying under this order, and when custody was settled, the battle to get maintenance from her started.

So the question is, since this order is from 2002, can I go back to court to get this order varied from me paying her to her paying me - I am currently persuing an appeal to the latest CSA decision, and will probably go for a variation (again! Done this in the past with some success) - in which case, if I can apply for variation, should I wait until the CSA procedures are exhausted, or apply for this variation at the same time?

Dear actd

Thanks for your further question relating to child maintenance.

Although the order was made prior to April 2003 and, also bearing in mind that the order required you to pay the stipulated CSA amount, it is unlikely that the court would vary the order to the extent that the liability for maintenance was reversed. The order is now irrelevant as the situation is so far removed from when the order was originally made that it would be necessary for the court to make a new order and take into account all the financial circumstances of the new non-resident parent.

Variation is only usually appropriate in situations where the non-resident parent’s situation has changed significantly i.e. losing a job. Therefore, variation means that the individual subject to the order would remain the same. The situation you have described would require discharge of the current order and the creation of a new order which, as discussed in a previous thread, is no longer possible unless the order is made by consent.

The court is likely to refer the matter back to the Child Support Agency who, as you are aware, currently have jurisdiction in most cases.

We hope this clarifies the situation for you however if you need further advice regarding this matter we would suggest that you seek the one-off advice of a solicitor who will be able to look through your case history thoroughly to ensure that there is no way for you to apply back to the court.

If you wish it is also possible to discuss this advice further by contacting the Child Law Advice Line on 08088 020 008.

Kind regards

Children’s Legal Centre

Wow, that was quick 😀

Thanks for the response. I suspected that the answer you gave would be what I am stuck with, but it was certainly worth checking. Certainly, last time I went for the variation, the CSA weren't too impressed with her tactics and ruled against her, so a second time around, I'm sure they aren't going to let her get away with anything if they can help it.

Thanks for the reply to my original question.

The court order was part of a divorce. There was no consent and the implication at the time was that I couldn't be assessed by the CSA.

After the court hearing my barrister asked for a meeting with the Master and then we were asked to see if the CSA would assess me. I contacted the CSA and they said that it was ok and now I'm waiting for the CSA value. They have given me an indication and it's much less than the court order.

It appears that the only option open to me is to go back to court to get the order overturned.......however I am still angry and unclear as to why the court could award child maintenance when we have the CSA to do this.

Hi,

I would actually like to contradict the above.

If an order was made through Divorce proceedings relating to maintenance i.e. Consent Order. This judgement will stand for a period of 12months.

After 12months the CSA does have the power to overrule any previous court decisions.

It would therefore be possible for you after 12months to contact the CSA who will then overrule the court order. Some people while i do respect their opinion, experience and input underestimate the power that the CSA actually does have. It is only one of a handful of departments with the power to overrule court orders, agreements (written or otherwise) and the authority to dismiss evidence as it sees fit.

I will find the actual piece of text and re-post tomorrow when i have my docs.

Found my docs:

Section 4 (10) (aa) of Child Support Act 1991 the Child Support Agency have jurisdiction to override any court decision made after 03/03/2003