[Solved] Supporting my partner during PSO and Contact order

I am sure that you can be present in the room but will not be able to contribute.

Anyone else?

Regards,

Dave

There is stuff on having a McKenzie friend and perhaps you could do this and be allowed in the room.

Does he have PR now? Or is this an application for this?

Ignore the solicitor. State clearly the terms you want and be firm.

BW

DAVE lol - you beat me.....

He does have a right to a Mackenzie Friend as he tried mediation and his ex refused. Could anyone tell me a bit more about what there involvement and input would be please?

Yes he has PR, sorry forgot to add that

If the Solicitor says anything like that again,i.e lucky to get contact, or something else to do with contact, the reply is "that will be the Court's decision" or "that is why we are here today".

I would even consider stating to the Solicitor that if she cannot treat your partner with respect, not to speak to him at all. Or even ask her whether she would treat a Solicitor in that manner? I can assure you she would not!!!

Your partner was right not to defend himself if he had not seen the ex' statement prior to the hearing, and if they try that again, just object to it.

Now as your partner's new partner I have a feeling that she would object to you being in the Court, even if you went in as the Mackenzie Friend. Strictly speaking, under the Children Act, only people involved (i.e. parents or others involved such as Social Services or Grandparents if they have made the application or want to make an application etc) in the case are entitled to be in the Court. It is also up to the Judge whether he allows a Mackenzie Friend in and if she objects to you being there...you may not be able to go in.

Although you are the partner, as you know you do not have PR, I assume you are not part of the Application and therefore the Court could refuse. it may be a good idea to take someone else if your partner wants someone in the Court with him just in case.

However, outside the Court room you can be with your partner and take notes to avoid him getting ambushed again. 🙂

Hi there las 🙂

Unfortunately it is not thought appropriate for a partner or family member to act as a McKenzie Friend, although it has been known! I think you should write to the court and ask for their permission to act as his McKenzie Friend....they are likely to refuse but there's no harm in asking! But theres absolutely nothing to stop you from attending with him, I attended with my son and was present during the meeting with the mothers solicitor prior to going into court.

My son also had a McKenzie Friend to support him and he found it helpful to have him inside the courtroom with him, and during the meeting with the other sides solicitor. It cost £150 and he was there for almost 4 hours. I know that Families Need Fathers (FNF) have a list of MFs and the guy we use is really experienced so I could ask him for a recommendation for someone in your locality....PM me if you'd like me to ask.

I really do feel for your partner, solicitors have a code of practice with regard to how to treat Litigants in Person and his experience shouldn't have happened....this is a tactic and a particularly nasty one. If it happened again or he feels uncomfortable in any way, he has the right to stop the meeting immediately and to let them know in no uncertain terms that their attitude is unacceptable and goes against the code of practice as outlined in the solicitors handbook.

For reference the Handbook is called the Solicitors Regulatory Authority Handbook, or the SRA Handbook for short! 😉

I would also (unless anyone knows any reason why it can't be done) record using your phone in your pocket next time outside court, just in case - if you wish to make a complaint against the solicitor's conduct, it might prove useful.

However, under no circumstances must you record in the courtroom, so switch it off before you go in.

Heres a little light reading!

www.lawsociety.org.uk/advice/practice-notes/litigants-in-person/

As long as you don't record in the Court room I believe you could record the out of court conversation, as long as you clearly notify them that you are recording the conversation.

I got the impression that actd was implying recording the meeting surreptitiously!...which of course would mean that it couldn't be used as evidence!

Yesssss.I did think that afterwards...but then as you said, it cant be used in evidence 🙂

...and they'd probably refuse to give permission to record the meeting anyway....but you can take notes!

Hehehe....take notes and record it on the quiet! Probably the better way to go! 😆

Thank you Enya. That was the impression I was under. Do we ask the court in advance if my partner is able to have a Mackenzie friend in the room with him to avoid confusion on the day? He has already spoken to the mediation group and they are willing to do it.

Ha ha, funny you should say that because since the last hearing we have been recording a great deal on the quiet! Unfortunately, because my partner was under the impression that the hearing was purely to formalise the agreement made between him and his ex (he even gave his ex a lift to the court because everything appeared amicable!) he was caught completely by surprise when the solicitor ambushed him. I feel that if I had been there that wouldn't have happened as I am much more assertive than he and she would have been told in no uncertain terms that her behaviour was inappropriate. As you say, had he been represented there is no way she would have behaved like that.
Thankfully, it taught him a lesson where the ex is concerned and he has never allowed himself to be caught off guard again.

Can we raise the statement issue along with other discrepancies when we make the application? I've since found out that much of what occured last year was not technically valid or appropriate. Particularly when my partner was unwell. (He never contested his illness and complied with requests for medical statements and records etc). He was frankly bullied and harrassed on numerous occasions. I feel like taking his ex's solicitors to court but we'll save that for another day!

Ah and I see I wasn't clear regarding the Mackenzie friend. I was hoping that as well as the Mackenzie friend I would be allowed in the court with him also. I couldn't be a Mackenzie friend as I don't have the experience and the mediation group have already offered him one in any case. I just hoped to provide him with a bit of extra support.

Las I would go to Court with him, don't forget that there will more than likely be a lot talking outside the Court so your support will be invaluable

You say that someone from mediation will be present at Court. I am just wondering how much they will charge you as opposed to a Mackenzie Friend? Have you considered those costs? Or does the mediation group have links with a Mackenzie Friend? The reason I raise this is because my old boss was a Mediator within the solicitors I worked for, but they were mediation clients only, we did not represent them in any way, that would be a conflict. Nor did we recommend a particular firm, we just gave them ie.a list of legal aid solicitors within the area. However now that NFM are linking with DAD, you could probably get more clarification on that.

In your initial application I probably would not refer specifically to what happened last year, other than in a general way, but if and when the DJ orders you to file statements, you can go into more details at that time. For example in your application write something like "since the matter was last in Court certain matters have come to my attention, and I need the assistance of the Court to deal with these discrepancies and contact". Something along those.

As for asking for a Mackenzie Friend to be present in Court beforehand, I think you may be better off doing that, rather than the DJ refusing you on the day, but as NJ is in training for that she is probably better placed to let you know about that. 🙂

Thank you again. When my partner attended the mediation apt a Mackenzie friend was mentioned should he need to go back to court. He had a call today from the lady with whom the apt took place as my partner wanted to enquire about the Mackenzie friend thing and he has to speak to the court who will provide him with a list of MF in our area so that's all resolved. His letter stating that his ex refused to attend mediation is also in the post to him today. On Monday we're off to court to get hold of copies of all paperwork that mysteriously didn't find it's way to us and a subject access request has been sent to Cafcass as they have never had direct contact with my partner but have filed two reports based on interviews with his ex so it's full steam ahead! Thank you everyone who's advised so far. I'm sure I'll be back soon with more questions but in the mean time I'll keep you all posted, sort of feels like we're all friends on here now ha ha!

That's great news las...do clarify what the MF charges, and it might be wise to ask them for testimonials...Remember, MF services are currently unregulated and there are some unscrupulous ones out there.

Thank you Nannyjane. I didn't realise they were unregulated so I'll make sure we see some testimonials. This site has really been a god send!

That's great news! Getting a list from the Court is great, because they will be independent, but as NJ says, check their testimonials. You could ask the Court how the MFs made it on to their list, is it because the MFs applied or the Court have dealings with them.. just could help you in your decision making process 🙂

Yes, I wouldn't think the court would recommend any one MF as such so it is better to ask about how the list is compiled....and as well as the testimonials you can google them and see what else you can find out...ah the joys of google! 😆