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Just been served with a non mol court date?

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Champagne
(@champagne)
Estimable Member

Yes, the choice is yours whether you oppose the order or not.  Unfortunately you can't claim loss of earnings against the mother but its very unlikely that costs will be awarded against you.  If the Judge is only dealing with the non mol, he/she won't discuss child contact at the same time but will advise you to make a separate application.  It sounds as though your application is behind this one so they won't be heard together.  You can explain that you have applied for contact and, if the non mol is made, you can ask for a clause that you can contact your ex for the purpose of arranging child contact.  However, as you daughter is so young and you haven't seen her for some time, be prepared for any agreed contact to be at a contact centre in the first instance when that hearing takes place.  

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Posted : 26/11/2021 5:44 pm
DadLad liked
Djsmith
(@djsmith)
Estimable Member Registered

@prisma 

Hi

Looks as it sounds like you need to take a deep breath because I needed to!
Cofeeman talks a lot of sense I can fully understand the anger and frustration in all this!
Mine came out of the Blue but to a degree, it was well planned I give x that but at the time my head was all over the shop yes got a Solicitor on board which did not help x, legal aid I could have fought the none m but at what cost.
Be in Debit ok if I had won what would I have achieved (That's what you have to ask yourself)
If you have legal Aid great but if not you could go down the root of acceptance with no findings against (Judge will 90% award an NM Just on words and Drama)

At present, the court system and CAFCASS are very Bias not only do you have to fight against CaCASS/Courts and the system.

Took me time to work that out but it helps to have help and guidance but at the end, you have to be clear from the start and stick with it I was lucky that my children are 17 going on 18 / 13 going on 14 so have seen all of there younger years not going to lie to you it is going to be tuff.

Keep all correspondence do not go into battle mode as x would have won.

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Posted : 26/11/2021 6:47 pm
DadLad liked

how contact centres work

DadLad
(@dadlad)
Trusted Member Registered

I have just spent the past 5/6 hours going through the statement and pulling it apart one by one with evidence to back it up. I will not agree to things that are untrue and I certainly will not allow someone to abuse this power to try and diminish me. I wont accept something that is against who I am, I can't be unauthentic to myself as this wont sit with me. I will fight for the truth, karma is very real and I believe I have nothing but good intentions in my heart.

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Topic starter Posted : 26/11/2021 10:31 pm
Cofeeman
(@cofeeman)
Eminent Member Registered
Posted by: @prisma

I have just spent the past 5/6 hours going through the statement and pulling it apart one by one with evidence to back it up. I will not agree to things that are untrue and I certainly will not allow someone to abuse this power to try and diminish me. I wont accept something that is against who I am, I can't be unauthentic to myself as this wont sit with me. I will fight for the truth, karma is very real and I believe I have nothing but good intentions in my heart.

Just to add to this, if you have evidence which shows the statement to be false then that will definitely aid you. I did the same and in my opinion, I wiped the floor with the ex's barrister. When she tried to raise an allegation I had evidence of the contrary (I represented myself). The barrister does not know the case like you do, so you can catch them out if your ex's statement isn't solid. 

I can only go on my experience, others may find the courts and system to be biased. I certainly wouldn't disagree with them. I think maybe in cases where you're not fortunate enough to have solid evidence to disprove allegations then the court may just be cautious and accept the non-molestation application to be safe rather than sorry. The system is tilted in the favour of females at the moment due to society, unfortunately that means those abusing the system and making false allegations often prevail. 

Make no doubt about it, it won't be easy, the system/judges won't protect you. You're going to have to stand up for yourself in there and force your will on the judges intellectually. Put it to them; this part of the statement is a lie, here's my evidence proving that's the case. Don't give them the option to judge your case any other way. 

This has been my experience throughout, including child arrangements proceedings. If you sit back passively and just take it, then you will get what you're given, and as most here have found, it's often not satisfactory. This is just another case to them that they want to get signed off following the current guidelines. If you don't want pickles on your burger, you have to speak up. 

Finally, if you were to be unsuccessful, then I don't see how you are worse off than if you had just accepted an undertaking. The restrictions will still be in place and the mother can still accuse you of breaches going forward when collecting your children. Both would also expire after a certain time if no breaches were reported.  

Good luck with everything, whichever route you decide to take. 

This post was modified 2 months ago by Cofeeman
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Posted : 27/11/2021 12:51 pm
DadLad liked

top tips to support your child after breakup

Cofeeman
(@cofeeman)
Eminent Member Registered

Apologies for another post, just a piece of advice if you do decide to contest and represent yourself. 

If offered the choice to speak first or second when giving your closing points, choose to speak second. That way, you know what points the barrister has made and can argue them in your closing statement. 

In my case, I spoke first. This meant the barrister attempted to make points which were factually incorrect after I had spoken. I would of been able to rip those apart also had I spoken last. 

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Posted : 27/11/2021 1:01 pm
DadLad and Bill337 liked
DadLad
(@dadlad)
Trusted Member Registered
Posted by: @cofeeman
Posted by: @prisma

I have just spent the past 5/6 hours going through the statement and pulling it apart one by one with evidence to back it up. I will not agree to things that are untrue and I certainly will not allow someone to abuse this power to try and diminish me. I wont accept something that is against who I am, I can't be unauthentic to myself as this wont sit with me. I will fight for the truth, karma is very real and I believe I have nothing but good intentions in my heart.

Just to add to this, if you have evidence which shows the statement to be false then that will definitely aid you. I did the same and in my opinion, I wiped the floor with the ex's barrister. When she tried to raise an allegation I had evidence of the contrary (I represented myself). The barrister does not know the case like you do, so you can catch them out if your ex's statement isn't solid. 

I can only go on my experience, others may find the courts and system to be biased. I certainly wouldn't disagree with them. I think maybe in cases where you're not fortunate enough to have solid evidence to disprove allegations then the court may just be cautious and accept the non-molestation application to be safe rather than sorry. The system is tilted in the favour of females at the moment due to society, unfortunately that means those abusing the system and making false allegations often prevail. 

Make no doubt about it, it won't be easy, the system/judges won't protect you. You're going to have to stand up for yourself in there and force your will on the judges intellectually. Put it to them; this part of the statement is a lie, here's my evidence proving that's the case. Don't give them the option to judge your case any other way. 

This has been my experience throughout, including child arrangements proceedings. If you sit back passively and just take it, then you will get what you're given, and as most here have found, it's often not satisfactory. This is just another case to them that they want to get signed off following the current guidelines. If you don't want pickles on your burger, you have to speak up. 

Finally, if you were to be unsuccessful, then I don't see how you are worse off than if you had just accepted an undertaking. The restrictions will still be in place and the mother can still accuse you of breaches going forward when collecting your children. Both would also expire after a certain time if no breaches were reported.  

Good luck with everything, whichever route you decide to take. 

Thank you for your wise words and I will definitely take your advice on board.

I have a few questions, the application wasn’t granted based on lack of evidence which is why the judge would like to hear my version of events on Monday.

When I refuse to accept the allegations and undertakings. Does this then go to a hearing? Or will they want me to present evidence on Monday? I assume that Monday will be to accept or not?

Also, because I’m being taken to court, will I still have to pay for any legal costs at all throughout this whole process?

Lastly, even though there are no contact arrangements in place or a contact order. Can I ask the judge to issue some form of contact even if it’s in a contact centre? My child will be over 1 years old by the time I see my child and I am missing out on so much. Especially as it will be the first Christmas this year.

 

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Topic starter Posted : 27/11/2021 3:27 pm

Champagne
(@champagne)
Estimable Member

If you refuse to accept the allegations and undertakings then it will go to a hearing.  You won't have to pay legal costs if you lose.  The only costs will be if you have legal representation.  The child arrangements order is a separate matter so the Judge won't consider that unless the application is before him/her.  If some sort of order is made you can ask that its worded to permit contact for child arrangements.  However, if not, then when the child arrangements is considered, you can ask for any non mol/undertakings order  (if that happens) to be amended.

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Posted : 27/11/2021 6:55 pm
DadLad liked
DadLad
(@dadlad)
Trusted Member Registered

Looking at this application, she thought it would be as simple as fill out the form with malicious lies to make him look like a danger and I will get my precious order granted.

Little did she know that the judge has looked at the application and thought hmm there isn’t any evidence to suggest that her allegations are true and didn’t grant it. This is clearly a contact issue only and they want to hear my side of the story.

 

Its so sad how desperate she has become, she is really clutching at straws now. She has also applied for a injunction order so I am also waiting for that call any day soon. 

“When people throw bricks at you, build a house”

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Topic starter Posted : 28/11/2021 11:46 am

how contact centres work

DadLad
(@dadlad)
Trusted Member Registered

Apologies for yet more questions but:

1. What can I put in place to stop my ex from making further false allegations to manipulate the situation?

2. Can she apply for a non mol order and a injunction at the same time?

3. She has used mediation notes as evidence (which clearly states that they are private and confidential) can I contest this or not?

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Topic starter Posted : 28/11/2021 2:35 pm
Champagne
(@champagne)
Estimable Member

1    I guess you could put in an application for a non mol based on harassment.  

2     A non mol is the same as an injunction.  They used to be called injunctions but  now known as a Non Molestation Order to give it the full title

3    Tricky one.  Sounds as though she's already used them.  The Judge may feel that they're relevant.

ReplyQuote
Posted : 30/11/2021 9:28 am

top tips to support your child after breakup

DadLad
(@dadlad)
Trusted Member Registered

I refused all allegations and undertakings. The judge would like a statement from me in 7 days.

We then have another appearance within 2 weeks where the judge will decide if it’s to go to a hearing or not.

She also had a Mckenzie friend who was rather disrespectful due to the constant hand gestures, shaking of her head and making remarks all when I was talking.

 

The ex was also warned several times to stop talking over me when it was my chance to speak.

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Topic starter Posted : 30/11/2021 6:18 pm
actd
 actd
(@actd)
Illustrious Member

@prisma I thought McKenzie's friends were not allowed to speak in court, I don't know whether there is any way to put in any sort of complaint, or request that the MF is excluded from the hearing itself next time.

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Posted : 30/11/2021 9:16 pm

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